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Roll Bars May Become Mandatory

  #111  
Old 03-25-2008 | 02:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Blue01F250
This whole thign is just a knee jerk reaction to a not that serious accident -- I have seen cars wreck on the highway in worse shape than that truck at slower speeds. Why not make sure the tracks have proper concrete walls instead of inadequate guard rails that will keep the vehicle ON THE TRACK instead of letting it fly off the truck do a barrel roll in the air and land on a telephone pole...

I race my truck, will never be in the 12's.. but I would NEVER step foot on another track if I had to put a cage/bar in my daily driver/family truck... even if it could go 12's
Originally Posted by STROKETECH
Question for those here that know more then I do on the topic but do you think that maybe a good harness and some better retaining walls would have helped? Maybe a reiforced seat with straps? Dunno just a thought rather then cutting your truck up for a roll cage. I believe that truck would never have flipped if it had stayed in the track.
I said the same thing back on page 2 before this got crazy...

I think thicker walled tubing would be the simple answer -- just go stronger if you are worried about the weight, not up the speeds/times that things are required...

that truck isn't too damaged for smacking two walls and flying thru the air landing and then being floored and catching an edge and making a barrel roll in the air (not rolling on the ground which is why the "roll cage" didn't get tested) and landed up against the pole..

I will stand by my original comment -- this is a knee jerk reaction to something that isn't that big a deal. Maybe its because I've seen worse as an insurance adjuster, but I bet his helmet wouldn't have gotten banged up so bad had it not had a cage to hit.. I think the BIGGER ISSUE should be do the tracks have adequate equipment to contain these trucks/vehicles that will be racing on their surfaces...
 
  #112  
Old 03-25-2008 | 09:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Blue01F250
I said the same thing back on page 2 before this got crazy...

I think thicker walled tubing would be the simple answer -- just go stronger if you are worried about the weight, not up the speeds/times that things are required...

that truck isn't too damaged for smacking two walls and flying thru the air landing and then being floored and catching an edge and making a barrel roll in the air (not rolling on the ground which is why the "roll cage" didn't get tested) and landed up against the pole..

I will stand by my original comment -- this is a knee jerk reaction to something that isn't that big a deal. Maybe its because I've seen worse as an insurance adjuster, but I bet his helmet wouldn't have gotten banged up so bad had it not had a cage to hit.. I think the BIGGER ISSUE should be do the tracks have adequate equipment to contain these trucks/vehicles that will be racing on their surfaces...
NHRA rules dictate the bar must be padded anywhere your helmet can hit. I go a bit further.

It goes without saying that if your 5-pt is comfortable, you need to tighten it. Ditto with helmet.
 
  #113  
Old 03-25-2008 | 11:58 AM
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There really is some theory behind all this and Matt (big thumper) has made some charts to show it. While it's not the total answer is does show the amount of energy for the current 2008 cage and roll bar rules. These rules are for the same for all cars that compete in NHRA and IHRA. Doesn't matter the manufacture so they have cover all the air bags and crumple zones that cars are built for today. It needs to be noted that current production trucks do not comply with current car standards. The standards for trucks are much lower than cars. He has taken the weight and speed and made a easy to read and follow chart that shows the results. As anyone can see as the weight and speed change so does the point at which a cage and roll bar is needed. Look for post 260 in the following link to see his results.

In light of recent events. - Page 13 - Competition Diesel.Com - Bringing The BEST Together
 
  #114  
Old 03-25-2008 | 12:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Diesel Tech
There really is some theory behind all this and Matt (big thumper) has made some charts to show it. While it's not the total answer is does show the amount of energy for the current 2008 cage and roll bar rules. These rules are for the same for all cars that compete in NHRA and IHRA. Doesn't matter the manufacture so they have cover all the air bags and crumple zones that cars are built for today. It needs to be noted that current production trucks do not comply with current car standards. The standards for trucks are much lower than cars. He has taken the weight and speed and made a easy to read and follow chart that shows the results. As anyone can see as the weight and speed change so does the point at which a cage and roll bar is needed. Look for post 260 in the following link to see his results.

In light of recent events. - Page 13 - Competition Diesel.Com - Bringing The BEST Together
A rollbar/cage is only effective if you roll the vehicle to begin with. Something that is not currently a problem. If you do not roll the vehicle, it actually puts the driver at a greater risk. Hence, rollbars should ONLY be used where there is a real threat of rollover. Hitting a guardrail and having your helmet bang the bar can cause serious injury even when padded.


What he didn't show was the yield point of a correctly constructed NHRA rollbar, or the yield point of the roof of a late model pickup.
 

Last edited by McRat; 03-25-2008 at 12:29 PM.
  #115  
Old 03-25-2008 | 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Blue01F250
that truck isn't too damaged for smacking two walls and flying thru the air landing and then being floored and catching an edge and making a barrel roll in the air (not rolling on the ground which is why the "roll cage" didn't get tested) and landed up against the pole..
Gary's truck did roll. The light pole is what stopped it from more than one revolution.

---AutoMerged DoublePost---

Originally Posted by McRat
Can you show me where the NHRA handbook says designs are for "cars only"? Or, "we ignored anything but lightweight sportscars"? It might be true, but if so, it's news to me.
It doesn't Pat. What I am saying is the rules in that book were designed around passenger vehicles that typically weigh about half that our trucks do (I own an 06' 3500 Megacab).

Most of the basics in the handbook come from the 1960's. Cars were neither light, nor safe. Neither were the pickup trucks. Yes, they did have them back then. Not all the cars had seat belts even.
And they have not altered the rulebook since the 60's? I thought there have been a few updates since, but I might be wrong.

Relatively recently, in lieu of the fact racing was getting safer, they eased up on the minimum requirements, and so far have had good luck.

The #1 safety equipment problem is not the rulebook, it's whether folk follow it.

If we actually follow the existing rulebook, and run the trucks setup in a responsible fashion, we will continue to have good luck. No bias/radial tire mixes. Tube tires get tubes (stiffens the sidewall). Engines tuned correctly for drag racing.
The recent addition of racing higher weight diesel trucks is going to change the dynamics somehow. The insurance companies that cover the tracks are going to look at the trends and someone in risk management is going to figure it out without the help of any sanctioning body. A parallel example would be U-Haul and the Ford Explorer. You cannot rent a U-Haul trailer if you are going to tow it behind an Explorer. U-Hauls insurance prohibits it.

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Originally Posted by Radio Flyer
Don't confuse the issue with facts Preston....

BTW nice to see more hot rods here.
I'll try not to make that mistake.

Thanks for the welcome.
 

Last edited by lpreston; 03-25-2008 at 12:56 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
  #116  
Old 03-25-2008 | 01:08 PM
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Everyone claims the insurance companies, NHRA, and SFI are throwing a fit so we need to panic right now.

Exactly what (who) is making everyone think this is happening?

---AutoMerged DoublePost---

PS - If that track that had two guard rails and a light pole destroyed files an insurance claim to cover the damages, do you think the insurance company is going to demand rollbars?
 

Last edited by McRat; 03-25-2008 at 01:08 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
  #117  
Old 03-25-2008 | 01:47 PM
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1 Guy cant drive and now they want to tighten the regulations ? Theres risk in everything you do , **** Retentive people is whats wrong with just about everything today

Must have Turn ups or Turn Downs and Drive Shaft Loops at the Sled now , How many Stock Diesel Trucks are going to have Drive Shaft loops on them , People just say screw it ... Hell I pulled my First sled when i was 13 in a field of 30 Trucks and i took 3rd
 

Last edited by DB Admin; 03-25-2008 at 01:56 PM.
  #118  
Old 03-25-2008 | 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by DieselMinded
... **** Retentive people is whats wrong with just about everything today
Yup. Perhaps if it was the racers, or the safety organizations, or even the insurance companies, I might understand their point of view.

No, these are just spectators who think they know what's best for everyone.

Heck, I can remember when you could rent a horse, or buy a 3-wheeled dirtbike, or ride in the bed of a pickup.

Sad to see what I thought were our peers caving into this nonsense.
 
  #119  
Old 03-25-2008 | 02:02 PM
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If there looking for safety in any "Sport" then they need to realize that to some point participants and spectators do realize theres a certain amount of risk factor Leaving the Computer chair ,

I went to the trails Last Year to Watch Shockwave ,


Give me a break on Spectators at risk,, this thing could of killed everyone at the event ... Even the $8 a Slice Pizza guy ...well he sort or deserves it

I wonder what it weighs ?
 

Last edited by DB Admin; 03-25-2008 at 02:07 PM.
  #120  
Old 03-25-2008 | 02:05 PM
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Originally Posted by DieselMinded
1 Guy cant drive
Do you know Gary ? His experience level ? ANYTHING about the man to make that statement ?
I seem to recall more than one professional racer going through or over guardrails. Can they not drive either ?
Think before you type...BS like that just feeds the fire some people would like to keep burning.

---AutoMerged DoublePost---

Originally Posted by McRat
Yup. Perhaps if it was the racers, or the safety organizations, or even the insurance companies, I might understand their point of view.

No, these are just spectators who think they know what's best for everyone.
You only wish you knew what's really going on. LOL
You don't know and quite honestly...I doubt you'll be told because of the way you spin things.
 

Last edited by UNBROKEN; 03-25-2008 at 02:05 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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