Planning a Fummins
#1
02-13-2010, 04:01 PM
Planning a Fummins
Hey Guys,,, I'm new here, and new to the diesels, but from what I see out of them, it's time for my Ford to get a new (old) powerplant. I've complete several frame up restorations, but never had the opportunity to try a Cummins swap until now.
Last week I purchases a 1990 5.9 with 140K miles and is super clean and complete, right down to the wiring harness that is still on the engine. "According to the seller", it has 50 hp injectors added, the pump has been turned up and the timing advanced. He claims 19.2 mpg in a 2 wheel drive, 5 speed truck. I'd be excited to get 15mpg, after seeing 7mpg every day.
I have a 1984 Ford CC dually 4X4 with a great running 460 and a 4 speed. At 7MPG, it's time for the gas engine to find a new home. With 4:10 gears, I'm turning 3100 rpm to run 70 MPH, so an overdrive tranny is a MUST.
I'm not sure what transmission to go with yet. I am considering a ZF5 with an adapter plate, or avoid the adapter, and go with a Getrag or NV4500. Looks like the same money either way I go. I also have a Dana divorced transfer case out of a late 70's Ford that would allow me to go with a 2wd tranny. As a contractor, I use my truck, but I don't abuse it.
I'm not sure which alternator to use. I may be able to use my Ford alternator, and change from a V belt pulley to a serpentine pulley. Is there an advantage to using the Dodge alternator?
It looks like the 460 radiator would work OK, but I would have to use a crossover on the lower hose. I've seen this done, but I'm not a real fan of it. Dodge might be the better choice, with the flow running vertical.
I'm hoping to hear from someone that has done the swap on the mid 80s Ford with the TTB , and maybe have a few pics of mounts, clearances, etc. Hopefully, they can steer me away from any major pitfalls of the swap. I plan on building my own mounts, and am a pretty decent welder/fabricator. I have all the tools, the garage, and the "want to" to make it all happen.
Like I said, I'm trying to plan it all out component by component. I'd appreciate any and all advice, and even more, the technical info. I will keep you posted as I progress.
THANKS!!
Last week I purchases a 1990 5.9 with 140K miles and is super clean and complete, right down to the wiring harness that is still on the engine. "According to the seller", it has 50 hp injectors added, the pump has been turned up and the timing advanced. He claims 19.2 mpg in a 2 wheel drive, 5 speed truck. I'd be excited to get 15mpg, after seeing 7mpg every day.
I have a 1984 Ford CC dually 4X4 with a great running 460 and a 4 speed. At 7MPG, it's time for the gas engine to find a new home. With 4:10 gears, I'm turning 3100 rpm to run 70 MPH, so an overdrive tranny is a MUST.
I'm not sure what transmission to go with yet. I am considering a ZF5 with an adapter plate, or avoid the adapter, and go with a Getrag or NV4500. Looks like the same money either way I go. I also have a Dana divorced transfer case out of a late 70's Ford that would allow me to go with a 2wd tranny. As a contractor, I use my truck, but I don't abuse it.
I'm not sure which alternator to use. I may be able to use my Ford alternator, and change from a V belt pulley to a serpentine pulley. Is there an advantage to using the Dodge alternator?
It looks like the 460 radiator would work OK, but I would have to use a crossover on the lower hose. I've seen this done, but I'm not a real fan of it. Dodge might be the better choice, with the flow running vertical.
I'm hoping to hear from someone that has done the swap on the mid 80s Ford with the TTB , and maybe have a few pics of mounts, clearances, etc. Hopefully, they can steer me away from any major pitfalls of the swap. I plan on building my own mounts, and am a pretty decent welder/fabricator. I have all the tools, the garage, and the "want to" to make it all happen.
Like I said, I'm trying to plan it all out component by component. I'd appreciate any and all advice, and even more, the technical info. I will keep you posted as I progress.
THANKS!!
#2
02-13-2010, 04:28 PM
Hey Guys,,, I'm new here, and new to the diesels, but from what I see out of them, it's time for my Ford to get a new (old) powerplant. I've complete several frame up restorations, but never had the opportunity to try a Cummins swap until now.
WELCOME
Last week I purchases a 1990 5.9 with 140K miles and is super clean and complete, right down to the wiring harness that is still on the engine. "According to the seller", it has 50 hp injectors added, the pump has been turned up and the timing advanced. He claims 19.2 mpg in a 2 wheel drive, 5 speed truck. I'd be excited to get 15mpg, after seeing 7mpg every day.
15mpg should be obtanable in your set up with a manual tranny
I have a 1984 Ford CC dually 4X4 with a great running 460 and a 4 speed. At 7MPG, it's time for the gas engine to find a new home. With 4:10 gears, I'm turning 3100 rpm to run 70 MPH, so an overdrive tranny is a MUST.
Yeah, seing as how w/o a 3200 spring that engine wont turn 3100rpm under load I would Definatly look for an OD tranny.
I'm not sure what transmission to go with yet. I am considering a ZF5 with an adapter plate, or avoid the adapter, and go with a Getrag or NV4500. Looks like the same money either way I go. I also have a Dana divorced transfer case out of a late 70's Ford that would allow me to go with a 2wd tranny. As a contractor, I use my truck, but I don't abuse it.
Any of them would be a good setup! I would go with ateh getrag or teh 4500 though just for clutch options, dont know what aftermarket option the are for a ZF5 to cummins, I'm sure there are some.
I'm not sure which alternator to use. I may be able to use my Ford alternator, and change from a V belt pulley to a serpentine pulley. Is there an advantage to using the Dodge alternator?
I would go with the Dodge, its on the engine, No need to make a bracket or swap a pulley.
It looks like the 460 radiator would work OK, but I would have to use a crossover on the lower hose. I've seen this done, but I'm not a real fan of it. Dodge might be the better choice, with the flow running vertical.
I would see how they both fit then decide. If still up in the air, use the larger one...
I'm hoping to hear from someone that has done the swap on the mid 80s Ford with the TTB , and maybe have a few pics of mounts, clearances, etc. Hopefully, they can steer me away from any major pitfalls of the swap. I plan on building my own mounts, and am a pretty decent welder/fabricator. I have all the tools, the garage, and the "want to" to make it all happen.
Cant help that...
Like I said, I'm trying to plan it all out component by component. I'd appreciate any and all advice, and even more, the technical info. I will keep you posted as I progress.
THANKS!!
WELCOME
Last week I purchases a 1990 5.9 with 140K miles and is super clean and complete, right down to the wiring harness that is still on the engine. "According to the seller", it has 50 hp injectors added, the pump has been turned up and the timing advanced. He claims 19.2 mpg in a 2 wheel drive, 5 speed truck. I'd be excited to get 15mpg, after seeing 7mpg every day.
15mpg should be obtanable in your set up with a manual tranny
I have a 1984 Ford CC dually 4X4 with a great running 460 and a 4 speed. At 7MPG, it's time for the gas engine to find a new home. With 4:10 gears, I'm turning 3100 rpm to run 70 MPH, so an overdrive tranny is a MUST.
Yeah, seing as how w/o a 3200 spring that engine wont turn 3100rpm under load I would Definatly look for an OD tranny.
I'm not sure what transmission to go with yet. I am considering a ZF5 with an adapter plate, or avoid the adapter, and go with a Getrag or NV4500. Looks like the same money either way I go. I also have a Dana divorced transfer case out of a late 70's Ford that would allow me to go with a 2wd tranny. As a contractor, I use my truck, but I don't abuse it.
Any of them would be a good setup! I would go with ateh getrag or teh 4500 though just for clutch options, dont know what aftermarket option the are for a ZF5 to cummins, I'm sure there are some.
I'm not sure which alternator to use. I may be able to use my Ford alternator, and change from a V belt pulley to a serpentine pulley. Is there an advantage to using the Dodge alternator?
I would go with the Dodge, its on the engine, No need to make a bracket or swap a pulley.
It looks like the 460 radiator would work OK, but I would have to use a crossover on the lower hose. I've seen this done, but I'm not a real fan of it. Dodge might be the better choice, with the flow running vertical.
I would see how they both fit then decide. If still up in the air, use the larger one...
I'm hoping to hear from someone that has done the swap on the mid 80s Ford with the TTB , and maybe have a few pics of mounts, clearances, etc. Hopefully, they can steer me away from any major pitfalls of the swap. I plan on building my own mounts, and am a pretty decent welder/fabricator. I have all the tools, the garage, and the "want to" to make it all happen.
Cant help that...
Like I said, I'm trying to plan it all out component by component. I'd appreciate any and all advice, and even more, the technical info. I will keep you posted as I progress.
THANKS!!
Once you get the engine mounted there is not put 3 or 4 wires to make it run!
Have you looked to see if destroked.com makes motor mounts for it?
#4
02-15-2010, 07:29 AM
Diesel Fan
#5
02-15-2010, 05:45 PM
Great to hear from ya,,,,, maybe we can swap notes. My garage is heated, and I'm really itching to get this thing started, but even in 4 wheel drive, I can't get this truck to my house. I live rural, and am running a F150 with chains on all 4s. I love the seclusion, but it can be a pain sometimes. We have had nothing but snow this year in WV.
I had thougth about doing a solid axle swap, but figured I would get the engine in and all the bugs worked out before I go further. In a solid axle swap, does the TTB crossmember need changed out?
I could buy mounts and such to make it a bolt in conversion, but I love the challenge of building anything I can myself. I plan on using stock cummins mounts bolted to the engine, and fab mounts for the frame myself. I've looked at the 1st gen. mounts, but kinda lean towards the mounts on a '96 engine. Looks like better mounts to beat the vibration. Still trying to decide. Opinions anyone??
I'm shopping right now for a transmission,, looking at the options. I can't wait to get this thing started.
As for the long wheelbase,,,,,,,,,, I can't turn this thing in a 10 acre field,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,LOL
I had thougth about doing a solid axle swap, but figured I would get the engine in and all the bugs worked out before I go further. In a solid axle swap, does the TTB crossmember need changed out?
I could buy mounts and such to make it a bolt in conversion, but I love the challenge of building anything I can myself. I plan on using stock cummins mounts bolted to the engine, and fab mounts for the frame myself. I've looked at the 1st gen. mounts, but kinda lean towards the mounts on a '96 engine. Looks like better mounts to beat the vibration. Still trying to decide. Opinions anyone??
I'm shopping right now for a transmission,, looking at the options. I can't wait to get this thing started.
As for the long wheelbase,,,,,,,,,, I can't turn this thing in a 10 acre field,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,LOL
#6
02-17-2010, 02:31 PM
I was checking out the Destroked.com and Fordcummins.com web sites for information, and decided to buy the installation manual from Fordcummins. I figured I could use any and all the information I could get before I got this started. I don't mean to step on toes or put down a site, but I was really disapointed. I can get the same information and more, by reading the posts here than in the "manual" I received. Not much to it. Very little detail. It basically says "what can be done", and gives little info about "how" something is to be done.
Maybe I expected too much,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Maybe I expected too much,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
#7
02-21-2010, 08:18 PM
Well,, I'm about ready to get this conversion started. I go out to the garage and look at the Cummins ever day, and have researched until I can't research any more. Looks like a pretty simple swap.
I advertised my 460 gas engine this week, and hopefully, with less than 30K miles on it, it will sell soon. Either way,,,, it is coming out in a week or so. I can't wait!!
I'm leaning towards a ZF5 and an adapter plate at the moment. I'm not sure with 4.11 gears that the OD tranny will be enough to get the RPMs down where I need them though. A ring and pinion change may be necessary also. Running at 70 MPH with OD, I can get the rpms down to about 2400, and changing to 3.50 gears should get it to 2050. I will get it on the road first, then decide where to go from there.
I will try to document everything, and I'm sure there will be more questions.
I appreciate everyones help.
I advertised my 460 gas engine this week, and hopefully, with less than 30K miles on it, it will sell soon. Either way,,,, it is coming out in a week or so. I can't wait!!
I'm leaning towards a ZF5 and an adapter plate at the moment. I'm not sure with 4.11 gears that the OD tranny will be enough to get the RPMs down where I need them though. A ring and pinion change may be necessary also. Running at 70 MPH with OD, I can get the rpms down to about 2400, and changing to 3.50 gears should get it to 2050. I will get it on the road first, then decide where to go from there.
I will try to document everything, and I'm sure there will be more questions.
I appreciate everyones help.
#8
02-21-2010, 08:41 PM
Diesel Fan
Mark
I used the ZF in one cummins Ford conversion cause I got a good deal on and adapter. I like the ZF, but it kinda rattled from the harmonics of the 6bt. I didn't notice it going down the road, but at an idle next to another vehicle you could hear the rattle.
I'm keeping the 4.10 gears to see what happens as well.
I'm running 345 70 19.5 for tires, so i'll see how the 34 inch tires work out!
Larry
I used the ZF in one cummins Ford conversion cause I got a good deal on and adapter. I like the ZF, but it kinda rattled from the harmonics of the 6bt. I didn't notice it going down the road, but at an idle next to another vehicle you could hear the rattle.
I'm keeping the 4.10 gears to see what happens as well.
I'm running 345 70 19.5 for tires, so i'll see how the 34 inch tires work out!
Larry
#9
02-21-2010, 09:46 PM
Diesel Enthusiast
I like the ZF, but it kinda rattled from the harmonics of the 6bt. I didn't notice it going down the road, but at an idle next to another vehicle you could hear the rattle.
I'm keeping the 4.10 gears to see what happens as well.
I'm running 345 70 19.5 for tires, so i'll see how the 34 inch tires work out!
Larry
I'm keeping the 4.10 gears to see what happens as well.
I'm running 345 70 19.5 for tires, so i'll see how the 34 inch tires work out!
Larry
#10
02-22-2010, 02:40 PM
Taller tires really isn't an option for me. I am a contractor, and use my truck in my business. I can't imagine unloading 50 sheets of 12' drywall on a truck much taller than this one. Plus,, with duals, it is even harder to go tall. Overdrive and gear ratio are my only options.
I'm looking to be able to use my truck for towing, hauling, and everyday driving, but I really need the MPG. I'm hoping to get the RPMs to approx. 2100 out on the highway. I've built lots of gas engines, mostly small block chevys, but I'm really not knowlegable enough to know what the cummins is capable of on the highway. What is a good RPM to be turning at 70 MPH??
I'm looking to be able to use my truck for towing, hauling, and everyday driving, but I really need the MPG. I'm hoping to get the RPMs to approx. 2100 out on the highway. I've built lots of gas engines, mostly small block chevys, but I'm really not knowlegable enough to know what the cummins is capable of on the highway. What is a good RPM to be turning at 70 MPH??
