i broked my getrag lol
#11
12-22-2010, 06:41 PM
#12
12-22-2010, 07:00 PM
Number 1, what's shown in Post #5 is NOT the cluster, it's the mainshaft, synchronizer assemblies, and it's gears.
The cluster is what is erroneously referred to by some as the the "counter shaft".
The counter shaft is the large "pin" that holds the cluster gear into the case.
Number 2, that heat damage didn't come from pulling alone, that was from long term continual low lubrication at road speeds, "neglect", if you will.
Resting your hand on the shifter while driving down the road can also do this, as well as burn up the shift forks in the top cover.
Given that the transmission is in great physical condition and doesn't have issues, the Getrag will hold the numbers this gentleman has, but you gotta' keep them overfull so the lube gets where it's needed.
You can't run gear lube in them and expect them to last, either, they weren't designed for that type of lube.
The NV4500 also has it's own set of issues, from a power standpoint, mainly mainshaft and 5th gear retention related, plus lube requirements.
Either is a "Light Duty" diesel transmission, which is expected to take people turning them up 200+ horsepower above their original design limits, which they weren't intended to do.
Mark.
The cluster is what is erroneously referred to by some as the the "counter shaft".
The counter shaft is the large "pin" that holds the cluster gear into the case.
Number 2, that heat damage didn't come from pulling alone, that was from long term continual low lubrication at road speeds, "neglect", if you will.
Resting your hand on the shifter while driving down the road can also do this, as well as burn up the shift forks in the top cover.
Given that the transmission is in great physical condition and doesn't have issues, the Getrag will hold the numbers this gentleman has, but you gotta' keep them overfull so the lube gets where it's needed.
You can't run gear lube in them and expect them to last, either, they weren't designed for that type of lube.
The NV4500 also has it's own set of issues, from a power standpoint, mainly mainshaft and 5th gear retention related, plus lube requirements.
Either is a "Light Duty" diesel transmission, which is expected to take people turning them up 200+ horsepower above their original design limits, which they weren't intended to do.
Mark.
#14
12-22-2010, 11:02 PM
Diesel Enthusiast
What Chrysler Reccommended from day 1:
Synthetic 5w-30 with a GL (4 or 5) rating.
Lube failures due to high viscocity (thicker than necessary) are a very common problem, as people instinctively fill a leaking transmission with the thickest lube at hand, thinking they are cheating fate.
In reality, the Getrag has smaller passages, therefore the thicker oil fails to flow and in so doing causes a dry bearing that heats up, eventually causing the bearing to lose hardness, then to flake and chip, eventually sending what in effect is shrapnel through the whole transmission.
Thinner, lighter oil gets into smaller passages, so even though it may seem that the lubricant wouldn't stand high loads, in reality it's weight and fluidness keeps the bearing from overheating.
This is partly why V-8 race engine builders tend to recommend the lightest possible oil, it's not so much the oil PRESSURE that matters, but oil FLOW and the fact that it's keeping the temperature of the part down.
In an interruption of oil flow, a momentary lapse in oil pressure is quicker to recover with thinner oil, as it flows faster.
Another thought to ponder: A smaller passage or machined lubricating hole adds strength to the part, ergo instead of making the part larger for strength, make any additional machining to that part smaller.
In so doing, it turns out to be a lighter part, cheaper to make, with less expense involved to make the part.
This is primarily why the G-360 input could have benefitted so well from a slight size increase in the drive gear end of the input, to allow larger oiling slots, plus a pressed in, hardened steel race for a bit more durability.
If this is over-explaining something with a (seemingly) very simple fix, I do apologize.
Mark.
Synthetic 5w-30 with a GL (4 or 5) rating.
Lube failures due to high viscocity (thicker than necessary) are a very common problem, as people instinctively fill a leaking transmission with the thickest lube at hand, thinking they are cheating fate.
In reality, the Getrag has smaller passages, therefore the thicker oil fails to flow and in so doing causes a dry bearing that heats up, eventually causing the bearing to lose hardness, then to flake and chip, eventually sending what in effect is shrapnel through the whole transmission.
Thinner, lighter oil gets into smaller passages, so even though it may seem that the lubricant wouldn't stand high loads, in reality it's weight and fluidness keeps the bearing from overheating.
This is partly why V-8 race engine builders tend to recommend the lightest possible oil, it's not so much the oil PRESSURE that matters, but oil FLOW and the fact that it's keeping the temperature of the part down.
In an interruption of oil flow, a momentary lapse in oil pressure is quicker to recover with thinner oil, as it flows faster.
Another thought to ponder: A smaller passage or machined lubricating hole adds strength to the part, ergo instead of making the part larger for strength, make any additional machining to that part smaller.
In so doing, it turns out to be a lighter part, cheaper to make, with less expense involved to make the part.
This is primarily why the G-360 input could have benefitted so well from a slight size increase in the drive gear end of the input, to allow larger oiling slots, plus a pressed in, hardened steel race for a bit more durability.
If this is over-explaining something with a (seemingly) very simple fix, I do apologize.
Mark.
#15
12-22-2010, 11:46 PM
Diesel Enthusiast
#16
12-22-2010, 11:54 PM
Diesel Enthusiast
I've never tried oil additives.
As long as it helps the oil and isn't in an amount that significantly increases (or decreases) viscosity, an additive or friction modifier shouldn't hurt the situation for the Getrag.
Some people swear BY them, some swear AT them, personally I consider them an extra step and expense that may or may not be beneficial.
Mark.
As long as it helps the oil and isn't in an amount that significantly increases (or decreases) viscosity, an additive or friction modifier shouldn't hurt the situation for the Getrag.
Some people swear BY them, some swear AT them, personally I consider them an extra step and expense that may or may not be beneficial.
Mark.
#19
12-23-2010, 10:08 AM
Diesel Enthusiast
#20
12-23-2010, 10:30 AM
as long as Derrik (Bigredgoat) knows whats going on then whats it matter?
And I will be the first to admit that I am no tranny specialist by any means but I have rebuilt 7 of these things now 6 went to customers and I have yet to have a come back
so I must be doing something right.
Its real simple to make these things last.....
1. Dont side step / pop your clutch
2. Dont lug them
3. Fill with a good 5W-30 syn
4. Overfill by 1 qt (5qts total)
5. If your going to do a lot of towing its not bad practice to run a trans temp gauge and a cooler setup
And I will be the first to admit that I am no tranny specialist by any means but I have rebuilt 7 of these things now 6 went to customers and I have yet to have a come back
so I must be doing something right.
Its real simple to make these things last.....
1. Dont side step / pop your clutch
2. Dont lug them
3. Fill with a good 5W-30 syn
4. Overfill by 1 qt (5qts total)
5. If your going to do a lot of towing its not bad practice to run a trans temp gauge and a cooler setup
