Saw a 500hp Common Rail get smashed by a relatively stockish 7.3 today
 

On my way to the drag strip for cruise night tonight with my buddy, and as I was making a left onto the road that the strip is on, a common rail coming the other direction made a right onto it (so that we were both going the same way). He kept eye balling me while turning, and punched it once I turned and got behind him (I'm in my TDI with a huge front mount btw). I floor it and begin passing him as he's tossing bucket loads of smoke up from his dual stacks, but cars were coming the other way so I ease off and get back behind him.

I catch up to him after I park and he's waiting in the race-line, and ask what hes got done. I cant remember exactly what programmer he said he has... I *think* he said an edge juice w/ attitude (although later I talked to his buddy who seemed diesel-clueless and claims it was a bully dog), a full ats race tranny, and intake/exhaust mods. He said he's laying down 500hp+ and over 1k ft/lbs of tq. I told him good luck, and go smoke some ricers.

Well as it turns out, he pulls up next to a long-bed single cab Super Duty (mods unknown) with an SCT badge under the Super Duty emblem. I tell my buddy "poor powerstroke, he's about to get smashed by that common rail". They do their burnouts, the powerstrokes was kinda weak, very very little smoke, and the cummins did a massive burnout and was covering the whole strip in smoke.

The tree goes green and the super duty literally ran that guys nuts off all the way to the finish line. I found the SD later but couldn't find the owner... so I have NO clue of the mods.. but the turbo wasn't excessively loud, VERY little smoke, stock looking tires, and an SCT badge on the fender. My jaw was on the floor.

Just goes to show that massive-HP cummins CAN, and ARE, beat by Powerstrokes pushing less power.

sorry whats a common rail?

One of the nastiest cummins ever built. 24v common rail cummins. Its a method of injection. Extremely high fuel pressure. Amazing for making power and economy.

All 6 injectors are tied to one high pressure fuel ral, which means all 6 have 3000 psi at idle. Electronics tell the injectors when to open, instead of fuel pressure from the injection pump.

Since when does smoke equal power??? A proplerly tuned any diesel will produce little smoke at lower power levels. Sounds to me the PSD was tuned very well and the CR was just a kid thinking smoke was cool.

WRONG. Common Rail is the method of delivery of the fuel to the injectors. The firing sequence is controlled by the computer through a wiring harness attached to the valve cover. As far as the nastiest Cummins ever built that is still to be proven as the CR's are still catching up to the P7100s. As far as the extremely high pressure, that is not true, best power and reliability is generally stock levels other wise you break injectors. And EXTREMELY is a very relative term. Is 8,000 extreme or the 60,000 psi spikes extreme?

Fuel mileage is gained in tuning not in the fuel delivery system. I still see Common Rails that can't touch 12V's in fuel mileage. Too many generalizations here, and I'm glad the Ford did well as the owner deserves the win as he has done his research. Hence why EFI is going to help the CR come along way.

Smoke does not equal power...

Your right, smoke doesn't equal power. But when I say he had VERY little smoke, I mean my 1.9l tdi smoked 10x more than his truck did. If anything he had a haze (not that I was paying attention to that). But typically the highest hp producing diesels DO have a good degree of smoke, and there's no way around that. The truck wasn't anything special looking, stock lift, stock tires, stock suspension, just tinted windows and an SCT badge.

Either way you look at it, that cummins was making over 500hp (which isn't ridiculous or anything... it's well-known that crd's can do this with a tuner and some minor upgrades), and that old 7.3 whooped on him.

I dont know a ton about the cr's, so I can speak for broken injectors (w t f?).

Fuel mileage IS relevant to the fuel delivery system; higher pressure injection equals much easier to control and tune for better power and economy.


Nope your right, but show me some 500hp cummins, or even 800 diesels, that make big-power with NO smoke. It doesn't happen.

there is a powerstroke i read about in diesel power mag. He prides himself on his "No smoke" 500 hp truck. I dont know if there is anything online about it. If you get the fuel and air mixture right you can put out a lot of power with no smoke.

Sure it can be done.. takes a LOT of tuning and knowledge of that particular motor though. Was it a 7.3 though?

The amount of power means little if the nut behind the wheel doesn't know what to do....there's way more to drag racing than horsepower and torque.

i dyno just under 400HP with the stuff in my sig. i find it VERY VERY hard to believe this guy had anywere even close to 5 bills. a monster set of injectors that say 140HP on them mated to a stock truck will produce very nominal numbers and a poor running truck with lots of black smoke. some guys are idiots and think bigger is better on everything. my 2 cents

lol isn't that the truth. HE told me he's gonna do a 4x4 launch... his BUDDY told me after (when i couldn't find cummins driver) he took out his front drive shaft because the u-j's were screwed, and he did a 2nd gear launch... so who knows.

It's pretty common knowledge that CR's dont take much at all to lay down some power.. but like you said, he might be clueless, and I didn't talk long enough to see if he's an idiot. I told him I've got a 7.3 and he looked clueless and said "7.3? Whats that?". I had to inform him a powerstroke. So in actuallity he probably was a dumbo


EDIT: You are also comparing your 12v to a common rail... there is not comparison...

1k... Little smoke...




LOOK at all that smoke... must be 200hp trucks...

Here is my truck with a dyno proven 430hp tune...

Cant be true because it doesnt smoke...

Lets not be silly here... you really dont see that 1khp powerstroke completely smoking out that garage?! That thing was PACKED with smoke :lol:

That drag racer was fairly clean, but still bellowed a few big puffs. Yours wasn't very smokey either.

Lets not be confused here, I said that IT CAN BE DONE, to where there's no smoke, but it's not very common.

quite an explanation. thanks guys :tu:

LOL... You dont understand what smoke is... Here is my old dyno tune, which locked it in OD... I thought smoke made power too.

425 hp on this run...

Smoke... Does NOT mean power...

lol you cant be that silly to think that I said ANYTHING about smoke = power. Because I never once said that.

Dont know... but everything there tells me you equate smoke with power...

Well you must be seeing things because I never once said smoke = power ;) :choochoo:


I said the powerstrokes burnout was NOTHING to write home about and was very smokefree, whereas the common rail spun his 37" mud tires like they weren't even there and smoked the crowd out with his stacks.

With 4x4 there is no reason to even do a burn out... drive around the water box and line up.

370 RWHP street tune. Where's the smoke? NONE....well, just a hint right at the line (you can see it in the shadow just in front of the RR tire).



http://s641.photobucket.com/albums/uu132/cleatus12r/?action=view&current=Cody-Pass5-14867at9305MPH.mp4
The present 400 RWHP Extreme tune makes a little off the line but clears up just as well.

Joe, regarding that dyno run video you posted: I cannot begin to imagine what your pyrometer said by the end of that run. That seemed like an eternity to finish!

Here is another video like joes. What kind of hp would you guess it makes?

http://s281.photobucket.com/albums/k...rent=00158.mp4

... I dont want to say what tuning that was... but...

It was not that bad because the water came on at about 8psi... He just ran it down to low once it locked into OD.

For some reason Joe's and PHP's links aren't working on my computer. But I'm not denying that big power can be had with little smoke:choochoo:

Better?

http://s281.photobucket.com/albums/kk204/dleigh007/2011%20NW%20All%20Out%20Soot%20Out/?action=view&current=00158.mp4

DB must not like photobucket links.

Just click on the title of the video and it should take you to photobucket.

Nope, still didn't work haha

But that worked.

Honestly no clue on power... once the turbo spooled it cleaned up nicely though. So whats the answer?

Re: Saw a 500hp Common Rail get smashed by a relatively stockish 7.3 today
 

That run was 340/787. Its still pretty smoky even when the turbo is spooled.

Nice numbers... what all was done?

Re: Saw a 500hp Common Rail get smashed by a relatively stockish 7.3 today
 

Injectors, IC, electric fuel, modded 17, tyrant tuning, AFE intake, exhaust, modded IDM

I was going to guess mid-300's.

It's hard to tell by smoke alone because even crappy AD's in a SD will put out more smoke than my 160/100% injectors do and they will consistently dyno 80-90 HP less.

Re: Saw a 500hp Common Rail get smashed by a relatively stockish 7.3 today
 

I need to update my signature im not running ADs anymore. I really need a turbo and cales hasn't had much time to tune these injectors.

I wasn't targeting you on the AD injectors (I didn't even look at your signature until now) but was just basing my statement on the HPO-tanking abilities of split shot injectors.

Re: Saw a 500hp Common Rail get smashed by a relatively stockish 7.3 today
 

I would believe it. Those ADs are oil hungry

So what makes them so oil hungry if they aren't anything special? Why did International use them if they aren't that great?

You can thank the EPA for that.

:argh:

Re: Saw a 500hp Common Rail get smashed by a relatively stockish 7.3 today
 

They are a split shot which requires more oil to run. They are just fine stock. None of these engines were ever ment for hp use.

Why???

Ohhh so ALL split shots require more oil? Why is that?

What do you call slightly modded? cuz I blew by a 7.3 blowing black like he was standing still today with my first gen 12v

Lets see here:

#1 Clueless OP
#2 Truck in question has an unknown modlist.

This thread is retarded.

Split shot injectors use more oil because they fire the injector twice(sort of). The first shot is a small pilot shot to start combustion and the second shot is the main dose. The split shot injectors help quiet the noise down a little. You'll notice the 99+ 7.3s are a lot quieter than the OBS PSDs. That is why.