Draw straw install
 

I just ordered a draw straw kit from Vulcan (Draw Straw 1 kit) and am installing an Air Dog 150 kit also. Does anyone have any pics of install or any suggestions, tips when installing these. I know the Air Dog kit comes w/ a draw straw but the kit from Vulcan seems to be a cleaner install and adresses the issues of low fuel levels. Any feedback on this. I'm also installing a fuel gauge kit up at IP. Thanks for any help.

Don't drill a hole in you tank when you don't have too... AirDog now has a pickup system that uses your stock factory fuel basket and it eliminates all 1/4 tank issues period. Even Vulcan can't say that... :pca1:

LOL

Actually, we can!

The DS1 as mentioned above is the ORIGINAL DrawStraw that goes IN the module bucket! Always has, always will. It is the fix for all '94-'04 trucks with an external pump! I can run mine down low enough to need 34 gallons of fuel without any pressure issues. It simply replaces a module fitting and goes to the bottom of the bucket. We are working on more revisions right now. In fact, they are done awaiting release. We have also had this model available with dual returns for quite some time. So a guy can return his bypass fuel AND his factory fuel into the same bucket he is drawing from with that 1/2" DrawStraw all in the same module.

The 1/4 issue comes from using a DS2 and not installing properly along with the use of bypass pumps. Also, the DS2 was developed for the pump manufacturers to provide them with a simple and effective way of reducing in tank restrictions. This was a low cost budget minded system and that's why it is the way it is.

It remains a staple today. And we are continually revising the line. Like the new DSV. Also goes in the bucket, replaces the factory pump with a positive located pickup. One hole to drill in the module top and it is the most effective way of getting fuel out of these modules.

We don't rely on multiple piece, difficult assemblies. We keep it simple and effective. With tens of thousands of various DrawStraws sold. we know how and why each product works and how to get the most out of each of them.

We include everything necessary to hook up the kits along with the proper fuel line. Not that blue air line used as fuel line or green line used by some that is NOT compatible with bio or veg oil. We keep our customers covered and try to keep the cost down. Yes, we could make a much more expensive system that would do more, the market has not requested that one yet.

So let's keep the facts straight. We do have products that do and always have solved the 1/4 tank issue!

Dave

Its hard to beat Vulcan Performance...:U:

Sweet, good answer. Never had anything that told me it solved it 100%. Plus the blue "airline" is rated from diesel to vegie in my setup lol

If you are using the stuff shipped with the kits out there, it is not rated for that use. In fact, there is only one blue colored hose that is.

All of our installs get the kit hose thrown out. I bet I have a pile of it 6' deep. We switch all the components for the installs to fuel/ bio/ veg oil compatible hose and JIC adapters with swivel fittings. It makes for a clean install and allows the customer to disassemble components for testing or repair. Costs us a few bucks, but it's the way it should be done.

Dave

For what it's worth here was my solution to the drawstraw issue. My truck never get's thirsty. https://www.dieselbombers.com/cummin...pply-line.html

Seems like I made a good decision going w/ Vulcan. I just hope the install goes well. Thanks Dave you guys are awesome to deal with. Also thanks to Rattler for the Quick response and suggestions. Everybody on DB are always willing to help out (that's what count's).Bubba that setup you have is a great idea alot less stress on the pump. Thanks for the input everyone. If anyone has anything else i'm open for any suggestions or ideas.

Thanks,
Clint

hey guys,

I am going to be droping the tank or taking the bed off to fix my fuel gauge sending unit,

What are the benifits to changing the straw?

sorry if this has been beat to death new to the forum

My setup runs a 7# carter on the rail and a stock carter LP with 6an hose and fittings and runs around 500hp with mach 4s

I hope your runnin a fuel pressure gauge someplace where you can see it all the time cause I would have a hard time believing that these carter pumps a feeding enough fuel to keep those mach 4's fed.

The draw straw is just one more restriction in the flow of fuel that is being eliminated. The same thing as getting rid of the banjo Bolts it opens up a bigger hole to flow fuel through.

Directly from AirDog....

The blue line that we use is Eaton/Weatherhead. I just went back and talked with our plant manager and this is wat he sent me.

"Our line is the Eaton/Weatherhead H201 “Easy Couple” general purpose hose – contains a nitrile inner compatible for low pressure applications in air, fuel, oil, and water lines. Note that, in this case, “low pressure” means up to a 250 PSI working pressure, and 1000 PSI burst pressure. You know the kind of pressures we’re operating with – not a problem."


:pca1:

gauges were the first mod after 4" ex

I actually peg my 30# gauge most times at idle some times it will settle at 21-23.
What does this mean.

Also What is the new recomendation for psi at WOT? I rarely see less than 10

why no anaimation of the avitar my glock is supposed to endlessly shoot !

I must add that the neiborhood diesel vendor may or maynot have switched the unpopular/hard to sell m3s into a m4s box so that maybe why I have slow spool low egs and high FP at WOT. Going to the dyno event at blowing rock, NC to find out

Your way to high on the pressure. at no time should the pressure leave the ranges of 7-21psi, never any higher or lower. These psi's may vary a few degree's depending on who you talk to, everybody has their own preference but to be safe it needs to stay between 10-18psi.

You need to separate these two pumps so you can turn them on and off individually. Running dual pumps like this also has some tricks to the trade that you have hopefully accommodated. Do you have a check valve on the outgoing fuel side of both pumps.

no bypases or checks.

The pumps are run in a series the stock hard line coming out of tank to a short piece of blue aeroquip hose then the 7# on the rail then blue aero hose all the way to back of stock carter then short sections of blue hose to filter than FP gauge fitting then VP.

My logic was that the stock carter only failed due to the burden of having to draw so far and not push like pumps like to do. And that with the 7 on the rail splitting the burden they should not fail either one.

BUT this leaves no room for error if either one fails the truck would be out of service until the bad pump was changed due to the stopped pump stopping the flow.

So its not perfect but better than stock...

what is so bad about running > than 18psi ?

not to invoke a curse but I have been tapped since like 20K and am on VIRGIN VP now at like 85K

I must have a non brass VP

"Thank GOD for a 56 block and a Good VP"

The high FP is caused I think by the sticking or improper operation of the bypass valve in the VP behind the return banjo- I was fishing for someone to tell me for sure earlier

Thats funny. I've seen feet upon feet on this magical blue hose that airdog uses piled up in the corner of Vulcan's shop taken off of trucks because it is not made for the intended purpose that airdog states.

I asked them why they take it off the truck, and looking at it you can clearly see the de-lamination from diesel fuel. Its also probably smart to stamp on the hose "use for on road fuel" which this stuff is clearly not.

I think people mistake the "magical blue hose" for high dollar hose that actually works such as aeroquip products. If it doesnt have an SAE and a number on the hose, it should not be used on the road.

Remember, there's many of us running 45 psi at idle and never any less than 37 psi. Still going strong.

Dave

Well, not many. matter a fact your the only one I know of actually. I'm basing this off of the Bosch Specs for the pump the designed and built, but to each their own. I know I've done my share of things that were different from the pack also so I'm sure not gonna say your wrong. But I'm also not gonna recommend it for others yet either.

I have never seen any specs from Bosch, been looking for years. The numbers you have posted above are what have been posted by guys for years that they "think" are the optimum pressures. And in many cases, electric pumps above 20-22 psi can cause hard starts.

But there's the rub, no one really knows for sure. But high pressures have not killed the VPs in trucks that have run a 12V pump with a cam lobe and no regulator. I have installed many myself, and I know of lots of others. I am not saying I am absolutely right. I am saying there is no real specs to guide us in this.

Dave

Can't put my hands on the Specs but they were in a Bosch Guide that a local Bosch Authorized rebuild shop I was workin with a few years ago had on hand. I spent a lot a time hangin around the shop while they were workin with me on diagnosing some fuel issues that Dodge and Cummins had both given up on and just wanted to replace the whole system. The problem turned out to be a series of smaller issues that added up to be one huge pain in the ass but I sure did learn about the entire fuel system through the fight.

If you can come up with an actual piece of paper from Bosch that would be great. Honestly, it would be the first of it's kind posted anywhere!!

I have been round and round with Bosch and this issue myself. A Bosch engineer that had direct involvement told me that the pump could handle as much as 65 psi before it started to cause any issues. Again, absolutely nothing to back up my statement. And if he was correct or not, who knows.

My point is, there are some gray areas out there and I stick with low fuel pressure is far more of a concern than high pressure.

Dave

well said dave. I knew you for one were running the 12v pump off the helix 2 cam. Didn't know there were "many" others.

The VPs in my cirlcle are pretty tough.

I had a hard headed friend that I changed oil on his truck one time.
I opened his water valve on the fuel filter housing while it was running and instead of the healthy steam I get on my rig his sucked air cutoff and liked to never re-started.
I pleaded and pleaded with him to change his LP he ran it almost three years like that before he had a board falure VP high idle and dead pedal. Im still on my Virgin VP after 4 years or so of being tapped 30+ psi fp. Matter of fact I added the 7# carter on the rail before I ever tapped my pump wire.

This thread has derailed and went 3 different directions :moon:

well, this comes from cummins themselves pressure doesnt kill the VP, whether to hi or too low. its all about the temperature of the fuel which is used to cool and lubricate the VP44, too low of pressure means less fuel, which will cause it to overheat and go out, 99 percent of the time thats the cause, the only reason some say not to run past a certain pressure is because the rubber diaphram inside the pump can burst and then its out. so on a used vp44, say one thats had a lift pump failure, it may have heat cracks in the diaphram which when running too high of pressure, it could rupture. so its a double edged sword. i see no problems running 45 psi as logn as you know for a fact that you havent had an overheated diaphram.:U::pca1:

So back to the topic of the OP: Draw Straw I install. I've just finished it and put the tank back in. Upon raising it and tightening just one side of the tank support band/straps, it looks like the top of DS head (the anodized blue part) is almost flush with one of my bed cross-members. Has anyone else noticed this? I'd hate to have anything heavy in the bed putting pressure on the top of the DS. I'll post up a picture in a bit.

IIRC mine has about 2" to anything above it, if I through something in there and hit it it's my own damn fault, not sure why yours is so close.

2 inches? That's strange. I wonder if the dually bed is different as far as the bed spars go. If the cross member under the bed wasn't there, I'd have 2 inches of room too.

On my 02 it is just barely touching. But there is a little bit of movement afforded by the grommet. However I have not had anything heavy in the bed since I did the install so I can't say.

His looks to be a short bed. Yours and mine are both Longbeds.

i have a short bed and mine is just mm from the bed members. maybe his is located in a different place

No mine is a long bed, I can crawl back under mine to varify..............

I'm thinking about trimming that cross member with a dremmel. Last thing I want is for that DS to get messed up and have to drop that damn tank again.

Oh ok. I was going off of the picture in your signature and it looked to me like a short bed. Its strange that yours would be different. Different tank maybe? Should be the same one though.

I don't think notching out that little crossmember will hurt anything. I still had enough room on mine for the DS to move freely so I'm not worried about it for right now. If I get something heavy in the bed and it does get tight I'll fix it then.

After a bit of adjustment, I have about 1/8th of an inch between the DS and the bed cross member. I'll try to get some pics posted up soon.