fluidampr and cam..
 

head gasket blew on me, so im doing everything while im in there.

i have a few questions about a few items, and i'd like a few answers..:s:

-do i really need a cam? my plans are for 700 hp max.. i think the stock cam will get me there.

-is a fluidampr a drop in balancer? as in bolt it up and torque it, and it's good to go? i know i might have to get the tach relocation kit. i will be spinning the motor to a max of 4k rpms.

anything else if anyone can think of it.

already have:
-studs
-hamilton 165 springs, 10* locks and retainers
-pushrods
-possibly fluidampr.

head is getting a valve job and seals etc. going to send the valve springs and retainers with the head to the machine shop for them to put them in.

Do you want a cam? You don't need any performance part, it's want. If you plan to spin large chargers or want any of the benefits of a cam then get one. They increase mpg, power and torque by a bit. About 50 and 100-150 ft lbs with a 188/220. Much faster spool. More usable power, cooler egt. Etc the performance is more in speed than actual power. So the question is do you want a cam or no. Ya you can hit 700 with a stock cam. But a Cammed 700 will be faster than a reg 700 plus the cam will get you 50 or so closer to that 700. I personally just bought a 188/220 lsa109 cam because I want that stuff and wanna spool a s464. As for the dampener I believe it is. I'm putting one on my buddies in spring.

Camshafts are a very difficult subject, no two people need the same cam,
Desired rpm range
Truck purpose
Driving habits
Power goals
Current modifications

Believe it or not, some people design a camshaft for there setup, that is when you are starting to get into engine builders and not built engines

So, is there an advantage in a cam? Yes.
But in order for us to help pick we need information. From turbo size/injector spray angle/timing/head porting and flow charts. Everything

Wpg, be careful just dropping that cam in, make sure to measure everything :tu:

I'll be calling Hamilton about proper specs with the head on the truck, got the cam and billet push rods for so cheap I couldn't pass it up. It's supposed to fit a stock truck and I have a slightly oversized hg.

With a thinker head gasket you are in the clear.
Valve recession = .055"
Piston protrusion = .018"
Install the cam on a 99ic
If it meets those specs, even with a thicker gasket. You should not have any issues with a 188/220.
When heads and blocks get decked and people don't check you can have some issues with that cam.
Zach will recommend pretty much the exact same thing.
Valves at .010 and .020 (he will mention it too) lol lol lol

Ya no measurements when the head was off. But I got .06 taken off and got a .10 over gasket so I'm .04 ahead which is hopefully enough. And I'll do the piston to valve clearance before install.

yes the damper is a drop in you will either have to relocate your tach or but the relocation kit.

While you have the head off take your measurements for a cam and write them down so you will always have them handy. If I were you I would leave the stock cam in there and port the head while its off and also o ring it.

do i really need a fluidampr? i will only be turning a max of 4k, and maybe 3k daily.. the stock one doesn't seem bad..:s:

also, im doing studs, hamilton 165 beehives, pushrods.. i want to be able to turn 4k rpms and live. i turn 3500 ish right now.. i dont really think the fluidampr is needed.

Do I need a balanced bottom end with a girdle and main studs? No, but I'm glad to have the insurance

I often wonder if the rattly 12V would generally run smoother with a Fluidampr.

this. always always always overbuild.

it will a bit below 3k but if you are going above 3k they make a big difference.

I do sometimes. And when I do, the last thing I want to be thinking is that my 12V sounds like a Powerstroke.

odd, that's the only thing I want to be thinking. a T444 beats the hell out of a 6bt in the sound department, to my ears.

To me they always sound like they're ready to grenade, which is appropriate because every Powerstroke in our fleet has done just that. 7.3, 6.0, 6.4, 6.7, get on any of them and they sound like a gas engine that was designed for 93 and somebody put old 87 in it. Like in spite of the shrapnel grinding around in the top end it's somehow still running. Like a handful of cracked marbles rattling around in a wheel...
I'll take my pissed off school bus any day of the year.

Powerstroke Grenade? That never happens!!! lol lol lol lol

You're right.. "grenade" implies one intends for it to happen :D

Which is kinda funny. . .considering I ran my 7.3 through hell and it did better than my 6bt ever has. All while having markedly more power from stock and getting the same or better fuel economy, and not sounding like a moose farting into the wind. I actually regret buying my Dodge almost every day. Which, if you had talked to me 3 years ago, when all I wanted was a Dodge diesel, woulda sounded akin to blasphemy to me. But so far, the Basket Case has spent more time in a shop than it has driving. Now lots of that does some down to the previous owner being a jackass, but really, when the biggest issue I have with my Ford was a fuel leak that I edend up solving for 65 bucks of used parts from a member on this board, can I complain?

Never had a single engine/driveline issue with my Ford. Well, i did replace a 20 dollar wheel bearing, and swapped out the dual mass flywheel I guess. . .The T444 was a good engine, and the ZF5 was an adequate transmission. At least it could keep 5th gear in it. The 6.0L wasn't a bad one either, emissions killed it. the 6.4 is an unknown quantity to me, and the 6.7 is unproven as yet, with some really cool stuff on it.

One thing they sure as hell don't do, is blow up transmissions, anyway. I can spend 5 grand on a 4 speed dodge, or I can go buy a 5R110 for half that. Oh, and manual locking hubs. if I do a froint suspenion swap on the dodge, it'll be getting an F350 Dana 60. Cause f*** CADs.

Yeah, brand bashing against FoMoCo doesn't go very far in my eyes. I loved my Ford. I wish I could've kept it. :D

We have well over 100 trucks in our fleet. The owner loves Fords so that's what 80% of them are. Almost all are Powerstrokes- we have some gas Fords, but even my Ford loving boss hates the Ford 5.4. Since nobody gives two shits about fleet trucks, they almost all get the piss beat out of them all day, every day. Every Powerstroke has blown except a few of the 6.7's, which are still well within warranty mileage so the one of them that blew was only an expense in that we had a truck down. Some get to 100K, some to 150K, but every 7.3, 6.0 and 6.4 except one went somewhere in between there. That one made it as far as 280K, it was a shop truck with a 7.3 pretty much only driven by two or three mechanics who more or less took care of it. Very few of them were modded, and there doesn't seem to be any pattern to how long they last based on it.

We have ten or so Duramax, all but one have been fine. That one seems to be a lemon, it melted down three times before 100K, but seems to be a decent truck now that the dealer who sold it to us rebuilt the heads for the second time. The Cummins are bulletproof. I will concede that every Dodge got a new transmission at least once, and very seldom do we change them in Fords. We've done more Ford transmissions than Dodge, but we own ten times as many Fords so that's not saying anything. We seem to go through transfer cases in our GM's and Fords though, and almost never in the Dodges. By almost never, I mean exactly once. Mine. Regardless, it costs a lot more money to replace a Powerstroke than it does to build a Dodge transmission that can stay together. And since- unlike most private owners- we almost never sell trucks, we buy them and then drive them into the ground until there's nothing left to fix anymore, this is a life cycle that I've had the pleasure of observing for the last few years happening much faster and on a much larger scale than most people get to.

That all being said, much as I hate Fords (and I do), I'm more of an age basher than a brand basher. You couldn't give me a Ford, but you couldn't give me a new Dodge either. By new, I mean 1999+. Most of the ways my truck has proven superior to our Fords over the last quarter million miles are just as applicable to our newer Dodges and GMs. I have the oldest truck with the most miles, pull more weight over more distance and generally work my 12V harder than any truck we own, and the records show that it costs so much less per mile to run between economy, repairs and cost of parts (not to mention purchase price) that it's just plain silly. To be fair, I've spent thousands on my truck that aren't in those records because the company didn't pay them, but aside from a few grand in the transmission none of it was necessary. It didn't need a new turbo, new injectors, a built head or a benched pump. With over 300K on it's clock all that stuff had already lasted way longer than any of our other trucks, it was still fine when it came off and could go right back on the way it was, aside from the governor in my pump. I did it all because I get paid to drive around in my personal toy all day, and I'm a gearhead who wants what I want even if everyone else thinks I'm crazy for it. But bang for the buck, it's still at the top of our heap and it's a very big, extremely brutal heap.

I stopped reading at "Since nobody gives two shits about fleet trucks, they almost all get the piss beat out of them all day, every day"
What uhh. . . .what exactly are you expecting to happen again? Most of the people I know who disliked the 7.3 and 6.0 didn't know what the things known as "oil change interval" or "cooldown time" were. Now I ain't gonna say YOU don't, or that your co-workers don't. But they sure sound to me like guys who don't care a damn.

I know that on a vehicle to vehicle, 1 to 1 comparison, my 94.5 Ford had more things from a design perspective that I liked about it vs things I disliked when compared to my Dodge. That's why my dodge has Chevy seats, will soon be getting chevy mirrors if I can wrangle a way to work them, and a Ford front diff, suspension, and steering from the pitman on. Hell, if I coulda, I'da put my ZF-5 behind my truck, since I wouldn't have had to bother with 5th gear and it's notoriousness, or fluid that costs 25 bucks a friggin LITRE. And bet your ass I'm tempted to just shove a sterling into the back diff spot over the Dana 70. The transfer cases seem equal enough for my uses to me. The Borg 1356 and the NP241 aren't different enough for my uses, although the NP might be easier to get parts for? regardless, overall, I liked more things about my Ford than my Dodge. My Ford woulda stayed very close to stock. I haven't stopped pissing around with my Dodge since I bought it. And I paid. . .twice as much for it, with twice the mileage. Cause of the Big Red C on the side (that means nothing to me, since I don`t have a personal affinity for the Cummins).

Cause Dodge/the people who make s*** for them, can't seem to get certain things worked out compared to FoMoCo. I don't actually know how many times I've been working on my s***box and said "who DESIGNED this? How did this dumbass idea get through quality control?!". The only times I did that while working on my Ford were when I swapped out the dual mass flywheel, and when i fixed the fuel leaks. And Chevy, well, Chevy just knows how to make a comfortable seat. Not much else. Plus, auto dimming mirrors. I like dimming wing mirrors. My eyes thank me.

they're all s***, they all break, and all of em do certain things right and others poorly.

If you didn't read past the beginning, you aren't in a position to respond. Regardless, it's hard to argue with that last sentence, and it's just a matter of what's important to you. In your case, you seem to have gotten rid of a truck you liked and replaced it with one that was used hard and hung up wet by someone who liked it even less than you do and left you to clean up the mess. I'm not sure why you thought this was a good idea, or why you've continued to invest so much of yourself in something that will only ever leave a bad taste in your mouth after you realized it wasn't. I understand making the best of a bad situation, but there's also merit to quitting while you're behind.

And to think, this all started because I don't like how my 12V when I'm revving the piss out of it almost sounds as confidence uninspiring as a Powerstroke does all the time.
Damn, I never saw that coming...
:argh:

All this because I disagreed with you about the sound of a 7.3. Lets be honest now, if I had come in and continued the laughter fest/circle jerk that was going on in here, none the more woulda been said. But now there's a point to prove. Dodge is better. . .or Ford is better. . .or something like that.

I don't like Dodge diesels as much as I thought I would, basiclly. they were sposed to be the cats ass, they ain't no better in my eyes. Always wanted one. I wouldn't say I'd be "quitting while I was behind" though. I've fixed plenty and made my truck better over the course of owning it. I've put blood and sweat and tears into it. I've learned lots and become a better weekend warrior mechanic. So no, I wouldn't say I'm behind.

I'd just say I haven't beaten it yet. It still leaks oil. It still has issues. It still has coils up front, and a CAD, for some reason only Dodge knows.
So, the goal isn't to quit while I'm ahead or behind, as you said. It's to make it into something I like. Something I want to drive. I've owned a 7.3 already. what's the point? No point in owning something newer, they're only more expensive. No point in owning another 6.5, had one of them too. Adding the manual to this truck was a good first step. The chev seats were another. Making it able to go into 4x4 like it should have from the giddy up was an excellent one.

getting rid of the godforsaken oil leaks that someone seemed to design INTO the engine (did, did Cummins hire a Hardley Ableson engineer or something?!) and then getting rid of the OEM front end will be good steps as well. It's odd, since my truck has no sign of death wobble and the entire front end is very tight and responsive. it seems to break the mold. and I want to go changing it all around. :D

In the end, guys who just HAAAATE on Ford cause "oh well our company trucks get raped and they break" gets on my nerves. Of course shit breaks when you beat on it.

Only our Powerstrokes blow up. My point was only that they sound like they're going to, but the fact is that they do. The Cummins don't. They take the same flogging and more, and they keep pulling. This isn't my experience with the one or two homeowner trucks I've had, or even the trucks all my friends had. It's the experience of watching a big construction company use dozens and dozens of examples from multiple generatations of work trucks as work trucks. They get serviced, they get repaired, sometimes they even get washed but most importantly, they get worked. Some hold up, some don't.

My point with saying you're behind is that you give every impression that for as long as you have that basket case you're going to bitch about what you have and lament what you lost. Some people just aren't happy unless they aren't, so to speak. That may not be you, but I'd bet that if you're still here next year and the year after that, you'll still be doing the same thing. I'd rather have what I want than try to make what I don't want be what it isn't, but to each their own. In the meantime I have way more miles on my 12V than you do, it doesn't leak, the CAD works fine pushing snow all winter, and the coils up front out-ride and out-handle every Ford in our fleet except the new ones which- BTW- have coils too. I never wanted Dodge until I got stuck in this one, and while there are things I don't like about it, it's outweighed by the things I don't like about everything else. Nothing's perfect, but it helps to have a good starting point.

Nope. Never will be happy. Always something else to tinker with. can't stop with my bike, won't stop with this. Always will miss my Ford due to the way it was taken from me.
Ride quality is the least of my worries. If you want well riding leafs you go get national spring 10 leaf progressive packs.

In the meantime, I'll fix this one and like it plenty once it doesn't leak oil and I've won.

And apparently I got the best starting point there is. Its just....the start don't mean much after 500,000km.
Don't you worry yourself. I'm sure in 2 years I'll be praising the big red C and hating on everything else. Like i'm supposed to. Or something.

LOL... I'd hate to see someone lose their moral compass like that. It doesn't sound like you got the best starting point there is, but I'm just inferring from your attitude where I've seen it. The whole paid twice as much for twice the miles and it ****ed me six ways to Sunday thing and all that jazz. What you've accomplished with it in spite of all the crappy luck is pretty outstanding though. You know how to step up, no denying it. I just think you might be a bit of a glutton for punishment.

I missed one hell of a convo!
Can I still join? Lol

They all suck. I just happen to like my body style, and the engine is alright. But it may get a built 12v to replace the current engine when it explodes a 6k rpm.
I like my seats. And my windows are dark enough to not needing a dimming mirror.

They are all junk, it's all about which is your favorite junk

Which junk does what you want better than the others. Myself, I'm damn partial to the Ram turn radius. Especially when I'm trying to put a long trailer in a tight spot, which I usually am.

I don't get the luxury of tinted windows where I live. since it's a single cab truck, I cannot tint anything bu the back window. I also have some serious blue eye syndrome, as it's called.

Spent 5 hours on it today. front driveshaft Ujoint (which had to be a combination joint since the diff yoke has been changed at least once and was not the OEM style), 0w40 oil, axle seal, caliper bushings, diff fluid front and back, and the T case yoke seal that I didn't put in before.

note: Inside axle seals are evil. there has to be a better way.

Also, Jbear: I like being able to hit 2lo for backing things up slowly. The turning radius never bothered me, and likely never will. Luckily my truck has a cable lock for the CAD now (still not ideal to me, but it'll do for now) so I do get that luxury.