timing relearn needs to be done-no security relearn on 96.

Can I just koko. Or tech 2?

KOKO will work but you must have a scan tool that displays the TDCO value so you know if further adjustment is needed or if it is within parameters.

ok so after holding back on the truck, i finally attempted to remove a injector line. sprayed some wd 40 on her front left cylinder (on gas engine #1) came off with a little muscle, didnt break:c:.

but with the line off i went to crank it i didnt see fuel being sprayed like id imagine it would, so i put a water bottle at the end of the line and cranked for about 10 sec. prob only put a teaspoon of fuel in the bottle. batteries where fully charged so she cranked over fast enough.

before i attempted to remove the line, while cranking she would spit and shudder and smoke was rolling(not running). even started for a sec then cut out. after i removed the line i couldnt get any spit or shudder for a while, seamed like the ip ran out of fuel. then she started to spit again but still no start

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should add. when i first unhooked the line and turned it over i didnt see it but it look like it squirted a little but that was it, saw fuel dripping off the injector and return line

The fuel at the injectors is minimal and does just dribble if the line is separated from the injector.

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Did you ever address the service throttle light problem?
It could be the root of what you have going on.

No service throttle light.

That fluid is more than likely fuel check FFM it has a in and a out as well as a O-ring in the bottom that will fail not sure of the size of the Oring but it more than likely can be had at a local parts store

From the first post in this thread:
i dont know but i think my buddy said the throttle light was on,

Yes I wasn't sure if it was on then but after I got her started there was no lights on

Been a while just had time to mess with her. But she spits and sputters if you unplug the crank sensor with optical center plugged in you get no spitting and sputtering no smoke no nothing just doesn't try to fire. If you on plug the optical sensor with the crank position sensor still plugged in still no fire no smoke no spit and sputter.

Ok,with the Optical Sensor unplugged and CPS plugged in the engine should start with extended cranking.
No start and you know the CPS is bad and should be replaced with AC Delco ONLY-all aftermarket sensors are junk and most don't work right out of the box so don't waste your time.

With the IOS plugged in and CPS unplugged the truck should also start with extended cranking and that tells you the OS is good.
No start that way can be 1 of 2 problems for a 94,95,96.

A bad OS electronic noise filter or a bad OS.

For 94,95 the OS noise filter can be removed and the harness plugged dircetly into the OS-you then need to go to radio shack and buy enough ferrite core to cover each OS harness wire.
For 96 you ccan do the same but you don't need the ferrite core.

For a bad OS the best soloution is another IP,otherwise you can replace the OS yourself with a used one from the wrecking yard folowing this guide-but be very attentive to the details,it MUST go back in the EXACT same location as it was removed:
Roy Halvorsen

i think i understand how you talk about eliminating which sensor is bad. but the problem im having if you unplug either one of the sensors you get no smoke no spitting or sputters, almost like its not getting any fuel. the only time you get a reaction out of the engine is if they are both plugged in. after cranking her for a bit of time you can get her to start but only for a second (revs up to 2k then right back down). matco man has a snap on scanner for sale and a matco scanner. new price 3k so being used (about 1 year) hes asking 1.5k would either one of these do me any good if the engines not running?

I wouldn't spend that kind of money on a scan tool for just an old truck,there are less expensive options.

A snapon mt2500 with appropriate cartridge and cables are usually on ebay for less than $500.

Or you could go with a good laptop program and cables:
FYI
Autoenginuity:AutoEnginuity
Carcode:OBD-2 Vehicle Explorer Scan Tool Browser

I have carcode and it does work but is the worst I have seen for being user friendly-no users manual and is not at all obvious what menues to use to get where you want.

I am afraid that you likely have 2 or more problems,bad CPS,bad IP and/or bad PMD.
More info is required though.
The CPS and PMD are least expensive to change.

My dad does have a mt2500 but he's off in another state. So was wanting to get a new scanner. But I did replace the cps with acdelco and after the replacement is when it stopped at least starting. Pmd is good was able to throw it in a known running truck and it started right up. I just don't understand why if you unplug one sensor or the other it stops getting fuel.

PMD is simple swap out,but make sure that you have a resistor to install in the new PMD,be it the 1 from the PMD you are replacing or buying a new resistor with the PMD.
(amazon has drastically dropped the price of PMD's/FSD's and the warranty is supposed to be great,it's about $120 now)

pmd is new, it was doubled checked by putting it into another 6.5 and the other truck started right up

If you unplug the CPS and it won't start after extended cranking,that tells you there is a problem with the OS in the IP.(or the electronic noise filter on 94-96 trucks)

Likewise when you unplug the OS and it won't start with extended cranking,that tells you that the CPS is bad.

Right but if I unplug either one it won't even try to start. The only time it will try to start is if both are plugged in.

I would say you have isues with both in that case-have you removed the OS electronic noise filter yet?

Have you installed a new AC Delco CPS?

Did it have any trouble codes before you tried unplugging the sensors or have you cleared the codes and saw what codes returned?

Where is the IP/PMD harness ground wire fastened?
Is it on the IP or elsewhere-It MUST be fastened to the IP and/or drivers side battery ground ONLY.
Is it clean and secure?

think the ground is still on the ip. never cleaned it so it could be a problem.
the cps is new from ac.
ill see on the noise filter i know its still there but kind of hard to get to with my hands, but it seamed like there wasnt enough wire there to bypass it

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im thinking something about how the old pmd was burnt up. it was either the c or d pin that was burnt. and it was the only pmd to work most the time (engine reving to 2k) but im wondering where those wires c and d go to. if the fuel solenoid could be damaged cause of the melting problem. would the koko relearn with out a scan tool screw with anything?

Borrowed from gmctd @ diesel place:
PMD harness wiring:


A - Fuel Inject control - grn - to PCM

B - FSOL+ - lg red - to Fuel Solenoid

C - Closure ground - sm black - to PCM

D - +12v power - pink\blk - to ESO solenoid and IGN

E - Fuel inject signal - small red - to PCM

F - FSOL ground - lg black - to Fuel Solenoid and IP ground

FSD connections to 4-wire IP harness connector from PCM\IGN -

FSD A green to...........A IP connector

FSD C small black to....B IP conn

FSD D pink\black to.....C IP conn

FSD E small red to.......D IP conn

FSD B and F go to Fuel Solenoid on IP

Black ground wire attached to top of IP must be attached to top of IP

On my 96 there was no problem removing the filter and running the harness directly to the OS,can't say on yours though?

thank you. we will see how i feel in the morning maybe ill be good enough to do some testing

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Its the b pin that's burnt

Better pull the upper and lower intake and look to see if the large wires on the rear of the IP-the fuel solenoid are shorted or need tightened?

:jump: sounds like fun lol. i will try tomorrow but i think its going to rain. was able to remove the noise filter, so next time i get a chance i will try her again. but im leaning to the problem being related to the burnt wires

well a little over kill but pulled the motor. inspected the pump everything looks good. but the bad... if we replace the pump we will be guessing, so might also replace the ecm just for "performance". manifolds need replacing (old plow truck) glow plugs need replacing injector lines look hurt and prob injectors also. this is the reason for pulling motor and manifolds pretty much had to be cut off. now just getting the funds together but have more important bills to be paid first. then we have to decide if the 6.5 is worth it or put maybe save some money and put a 5.9 into her :tu: