Rotella 15-40 no good?
 

Ok I used to work in a big rig shop. I started out in the lube pit and most of the owner operators who were real picky about their trucks and had the big Petes with Cat motors ALL ran Rotella 15-40 with a gallon of Lucas. Equivalant of my truck being Rotella with a quart of Lucas mixed in. Now I'm readin in a couple places that Rotella AND Lucas are junk? I don't know NEARLY enough to make an educated decision cuz I don't know about all the technicalities that some of you here seem to know. So I appreciate the vendors will want me to use what they sale and I'm open to hearin what they have to say, but I really want to hear from the unaffiliated third part guys to see what's worked for you.

This has to be taken in context. Lucas gets a bed rep for the wrong reason sometimes. Post links to the threads or places where you are seeing they are saying "a couple places that Rotella AND Lucas are junk?" and I'll give an opinion.

What about Additives?

There's a thread over on Comp D regarding Rockers being destroyed by oil and oil additives. Cant remember the details but it did have a mention of rotella problems, not sure if it's specificly rotella.
I can also say that the last two trucks with rocker damage I've seen were running rotella. With that said the oil had been pushed to far with bad filtration!

The lack of Zinc dithiophosphate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The thread that hosted this information was : Rocker Arm/Trunnion Wear - Competition Diesel.Com - Bringing The BEST Together

There's probably 50 threads regarding this if you do some research!

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And I second Heath on additives. Every truck that I've ever seen use additives had some pretty major issues!

Now, I will say this. After researching a little more, I have found that MOST of the complaints about Rotella have been from the 6.0L Ford guys and claiming the Rotella "foams up" and somehow causes injector problems in their trucks.

Kinda hard to blame that on the oil.
I wonder if Wikipedia also has an article outlining the current/latest anti-wear technologies being employed by the big lubricant companies to replace the old zinc-related stuff? You know - the ones that are superior to and actually perform better than the old lubricant technlogy? Probably not. Wikipedia needs a little more time for the contributors to catch up/on. Check that in another couple years. :w2:

I can't comment on the CompD thread because I don't have an account there and so cannot search. If you want to post a link I'll be happy to read it. I've done more research on this subject than you could ever imagine. I posted regularly on BITOG for the first four years of it's existence, but I'm not going to elaborate on that.

The bottom line is that most of this type stuff you are seeing around the Internet is purely anecdotal evidence. Some good, some bad, but mostly just people talking and spreading rumors and myths. There's nothing wrong with Rotella, and as far as Lucas is concerned, there's nothing wrong it per se, either. It's not a magic elixir to solve any and all heavy duty lube problems like the manufacturer would have you believe. But it won't harm anything either, used as directed.

Personally, I'd rather simply use a quality oil and filter spec'd for my application and changed on an appropriate schedule and leave the additives for someone else to experiment with. But that's just me. :tu:

As I understand it (and I may very well be wrong) - is that with the newest API certification of oils (CJ-4) is that they have changed the formulation (like less Zinc) to meet emissions for the newest diesels.

As for oil additives - I wouldnt do it. Theres mixed reports on Lucas all over the place.

Get some Amsoil HD Marine Deseil Oil - its still rated CI-4

I agree with the Dr. on the additives when i was wrenchin was told by my boss as to not use them that didnt necicerily do any good, just regular PM and you will be good to go. So just IMHO i dont belive in using additives. As for the rotella 15w40 I always thought of it to be a good oil and have always used it in diesels. So I too am looking to see what you guys think on using it as well. And BTW Dr. Evil what is the cost of the amsoil vs rotella seen that some guys are using an amsoil MTF for the 5&6spds and are getting better shifts by using it and i was going to put that in my trans but didnt know about the engine oil.

:pca1:

Nadir, I didn't mean to include that Wikipedia part. Personally, I don't put much salt in that place cuz any hoodlum can get on there and write whatever they want. My main point was the link to the demonstration about the Lucas.

I'm just really confused and don't know enough about the technicalities of oil to make an educated decision on what's best for my truck. So really all I can go on is what's typed in these forums. However, from what I can see from the link, the Lucas or probably any other additive or "snake oil" as I refer to em are probably not a good idea.

I don't remember what all is in the Lucas oil stabilizer, but it is mostly VI enhancers or something similar, IIRC. That would not necessarily be a "bad thing" for long-running oil in hard-working OTR engines and probably explains why truckers use it. Good for them. The Lucas demo thing was for gear oil, and hardly makes a good representation of what goes on in your typical differential. Lucas makes some good stuff, no doubt about it. Would I use their products blindly? Nope.

But I think you hit on the psychology behind it, and why it seems to be a continually recurring topic. If you don't know something about the "technicalities of oil" it's easy to be swayed by the snake oil marketers, or even claims of reputable companies like Lucas and Amsoil, who market heavily in order to sell their specialty or niche products. You should not be adding things to a finished product and expect it to perform as the maker intended. Maybe it will, maybe it won't. If you do know a little about what you are doing, why you are doing it, and what it actually does, then great - go for it.

Having said that, the best way to go and the way you can't go wrong is just use a good quality oil and filter designed for your application and follow a proper maintenance routine.

OBTW, WRT the thread topic - personally, I believe all variants of the Rotella brand are very good oils, use them myself. Shell's been around the block a time or two. :w2:

I like Lucas, it has slowed leals for me and been good. I dont like Rotela because as soon as you put it in it is black and i ve known people that have had problems and switched, but i think its all about opinon. I use DELO or DELVAC.

when people say sumthin bad about somthin like this, everyone automatically thinks its bad an bad mouths it, i would have to see proof that this is destroyin motors.. i use rotella a have 300k on my truck an never had a problemas far as the oil bein dirty is just the way it is on a diesel,

there is enough additives added to quality oils. period. I wouldnt add anything to change the characteristics at all. If something did go wrong, the question would be "which product is to blame"? Yes rotella is a good oil by the way. I know that if someone buys mobil brand oil from us, and has a catostrophic failure due to thier product- mobil will pay for it. thats a good peace of mind to me. go with yer gut if it feels right, then go with it brother.

I'm torn between Rotella and Valvoline for my next oil change, but I wonder why Shell fuel seems to have such a bad rep (around here anyways) yet Rotella is clearly a #1 choice. Probably gonna end up going with Rotella for the price and convenience.

I just recently switched from Rotella to Mobil 1 5w40 because of the cold weather. I ran Rotella in every big truck I ever drove and my pickup for 3 years without incident. My first gen, which is 20 years old, when I change the oil, regardless of brand is not black for usually 3-4 weeks after I change it.

What is the reason Shell diesel has a bad rep in Alberta? I've used it exclusively for years and never experienced a problem, but then the climate here in New Jersey isn't a harsh as yours in Alberta.

I used Rotella religiously in tractors and my truck until they changed the formula with the Zinc blend. I won't touch it now. For motor oil it's all Valvoline Blue made specifically for diesel engines and endorsed and recommended by Cummins.

My motor leaks to bad for synthetic in it but I use AMSOIL in everything else for the truck and only wish I could afford it for the tractors.

Me personally, I have used bulk oil from the local farm/fleet stores. "Harvest king" oil made by mid states company, and a quality filter, wix or delco filters in all my gas engines and in my previous vw diesel. Haven't had any troubles yet. The 15w40 runs good in my 6.5l also. Down to zero it always starts good, even with not plugging it in, but i know i really should.....

Climate factors in for sure performance wise, being from Montreal I'm familiar with your climate and back East fuel quality in general seems to be far superior. Injector failures are way more frequent out here according to my research. I think it may be due to the fact that Shell don't crank out the same volume as Petro-Canada or Esso out here, and I'm sure you know that it's always better to get fuel from high volume stations. I'm also sure that Shell diesel in the US is way better than the stuff we get.

I made the switch from Rotella to AMSOIL 15W40 Diesel oil about a year ago (last February) and don't regret it one bit. The Dmax runs a little smoother and quieter now. :tu:

what do u mean its black right away? i changed the oil in my cummins like 5k ago i usually go 7500 and i checked it yesterday and its still got teh "rotella look" to it only a little darker.
just because when you change the oil in a truck the new oil is black dont mean its a bad oil. when i worked at the TA truck stop a fella came in in a brand new freightshaker with a cat in it he said it was the first oil change whether i believe him or not is a different story but as soon as i started it up with the fresh oil in it to check the oil pressure shut it off and pulled the stick and it was black as coal. and that guy made sure i put delo oil in it i guess its just a matter of opinion kinda like brand loyalty

The only places I fill up at are the Shell Flying J Truck stops...can't get more high volume than that. I don't think there's a better place to fill up in Calgary. Anyways sorry this might be a little off topic.

175K exclusively with Rotella and not one oil related problem. Also, I will occasionally run a bottle of Lucas in the summertime, but never in the winter as the oil gets too thick to crank her up.

Only bad thing I ever heard bad about Rotella was from a trucker friend. He drives for a nationwide company and they had him in the shop also a while back. He said he could take an engine apart and tell if it had Delo or Rotella ran in it (This company uses either or.). The Delo was clean inside and the Rotella had a lot of sludge build up that the oil was not preventing. I would say there could be other factors causing this though. A good record keeping study would have to be performed to convince me.
Kind of like the argument about the CI and newer CJ oil specs. You hear both sides saying what they believe. I want to see some proof or something substantial proving one way or another which oil should be used in older engines.

Don't worry about how your oil 'looks' on the dip stick. My truck makes the oil so very black when I change it by just filling the crankcase back up. I can pull the dip stick after a change without starting it and it is so black you can't see through it at all. Means nothing because I know it is clean. Only way to tell for sure is to take some and send it off for an oil analysis. That will tell you exactly what is in it and what is not. ('Clean' or new oil out of the bottle can be 'dirty' enough that it is bad for your engine. If you or anyone else along the line gets dirt in it, then it needs to be filtered before use!).

A quality oil and filter are as necessary as I can emphasize. As well as changing it when needed. You can go with the old way of every 3,k if you want or you can run it about as far as you think it is safe and do an analysis to be sure. Companies like BlackStone will even write you a 'story' about your oil and give you recommendations about further use or change intervals. How soon you need to change your oil depends on how you use your engine. Shorter trips will leave more water in it. Dirtier conditions will require more frequent changes too. Basically the harder you work it the sooner you will have to change it. Now, if you get out on the freeway and just cruise - then you may wind up with one of the longest intervals. It boils down to each individual application. A 'one size' fits all plan simply doesn't work well for oil changes. A lot of factors have changed in the last few years to make the 3,k mile change just about obsolete. Take a look at owners manuals for new cars and you will see they are recommending at least double that!
If you do a few oil analysis to see when you should change your oil you should wind up with a pattern that will fit your needs. That way you won't have to do one each and everytime until your operating conditions or habits change.

HTH!! :tu:

I like Rotella,I use it on gassers too.Keeps engine clean,zero slugde. Diesel rated oil in a gasser is superior,more detergents keep engine clean.

I have a cousin who used Rotella thinking it would keep his engine clean well he found out that it left gunk inside of his engine when he tore it down to rebuild it. I can say he was not a very happy camper.

Reasons for sludging:

1) Improper maintenance (not changing enough)
2) Running low (variation of #1)
3) Malfunctioning/inop PCV
4) Using wrong grade/viscosity

There are others, but those are the major ones covering 99% of the problems. The oil is never at fault, only the owner/operator.

Both my 22re and Om 617.951 are clean,I adjust valves every 25,000 miles in both.My Dad taught me about diesel oil in cars.He had a Mercury S55 do 426,000 miles before trading it.

I like the Rotella too. I use it in both my trucks. Never had any trouble. Its blacker in my truck with all the mods, but I think its just blowing soot into the crankcase. My virgin truck is still clear after 3000 miles. I worked for a guy running a d-8 dozer, day in and day out in that dusty field. I figure if its good enough for that then it should be good for our trucks. We also ran Pennzoil in the newer 8. I think they are both good oils.

i run the new kendall 15w40 at work and now in my dmax and 6.9

Far as zinc and phosphorus content for high performance you want 1800-2000ppm. Its a good idea to also run a additive like ZDDP +

Zinc
Rotella 1000ppm
Valvoline 1400ppm
Amsoil 1500ppm

I have been running valvoline premium blue but will be switching to 20w50 of one of the following schaeffers, brad penn, or cenpeco. Since both of my trucks are used for pulling and one is also a dd. I plan to just get a 55gal drum.

Is it the new Kendall 15-40 XA TI with liquid titanium? i am very fond of that oil, for bieng a syn blend. Go to thier site and look at the ratings..

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Ok i have to admit something...I could never run my edge evo on the 80 setting w/o getting the code for low oil supply, then would have to go back to the 60. Since i have gone to a full syn 5-40 i have not once got the light. I now run it in the 80 setting all the time. I thought my oil pump was weak, well maybe it is..but as for now I don't have to worry about getting a new hpop. :tu:

yea, started using it about 5 months ago. for 250 gallons it was 400 buck cheaper then rotella, and so far my oil samples for all my equipment have come back great