Bigger Injectors
 

Hey everyone got a question about injectors. How big is too big where my truck really wont be streetable anymore. It is still my daily driver and I'm looking at 150Hp or 160Hp sticks. I am buying an Airdog II 165GPH pump and I'm guessing will have to buy an upgraded CP3 as well. Now budget only allows so much so I will be doing this on the stock turbo until I get buy a bigger one of those but will this kill my stock one? Any info would be great as I'm trying to figure how to best spend my money on bombs and that wont in turn bomb my truck. Thanks for the help!:c:

You will have to upgrade your CP3. If you turn your box down and dont do a lot of heavy towing you can get by for a while on a stock turbo. I would look at doing a turbo first then injectors.

What are you looking for horsepower wise outta your truck? And what do you do with it?

Bigger Injectors
 

I just put 90s in last week. They work awesome.

I have no fuel issues with my stock cp3. I also just put the airdog 150 a few weeks ago.

I might put the arson kit on my cp3 pump later to increase the flow. It's cheap and easy to do. don't even have to remove it

I would do 90's they will make alotta power with the right mods and tuning

Bigger Injectors
 

Got my 90s from industrial injection

Yep II makes awesome injectors for these trucks

The size that you can daily drive comes down to the charger set up and programing your going to run. We have a truck here with twins II race series 250hp injectors and its a daily driver. Tow sleds out west, drives it to the races/sled pulls, ect.

Thanks for the input so far. My goal is for over 700hp and to be a mainly daily driver with some occassional sled pulls drags and dynos. Sounds like alot of guys are running 90's will that get me to my HP goals cause i don't want to run nitrous (just yet). Or is 150 way too much and I should look at say a 120HP stick. Also would it be more beneficial to me to upgrade the turbo first. Really like Industrial Injections Silver Bullet 66 74 14 but not quite sure if I have the fuel to push that big of a turbo yet so you see my dilemma. Always open for suggestions.

I'd put the race series II injectors in. Then keep the programing down until you get the
fuel pump and turbo to run it. Your goal of 700rwhp DD is very easily done.

When you put the turbo on done a two piece manifold at the same time.

JagsDiesel thanks for the advice man. Its funny that you mention the manifold cause i just picked up an AFE Bladerunner for a steal and couldn't leave it. I think that I am going to take your advice and do the injectors first and just keep my programmer tuned down until the rest of the upgrades are done. When I do the injectors the head studs and Air Dog are going on as well so it will be a while before the CP3 and turbo go on but hey thats the name of the game. So who has the best deal on injectors and head studs?

I am running almost exactly what you are talking about on my truck. Mine is an 03 5.9L. I am running the following mods.

Industrial Injections Silver 66
Dual CP3's
220 horse injectors
Air Dog 150
ARP Head Studs
BD Diesel 2 piece exhaust manifold
BD Intercooler and intake manifold
AFE Stage 2 cold air intake
Fluidampnr
South Bend Iron Giant 2 clutch
Edge Juice w/ Attitude Stacked with a Smarty Revo TNT firmware
Stock valve springs, cam, headgasket, ect. ect.

I have been to more dyno events than I care to remember. Mostly for advertising purposes. My best at this point was 733 on a good loading dyno with Smarty on 7 Edge on 3. Worst I have ever seen was 623 with Smarty only. I drive this truck every single day and I have been running this settup for over 3 years now with no breakage or issues other than a few clutches. I towed a 35' triple axle goose neck loaded to about 20,000 Pounds on a daily basis for 2 years.

I hope this is helpful in your build. Feel free to call anytime and pick my brain as well. 208-777-1977

If your looking for a price you might want to be specific. On the injectors for example.
Are you looking for full body or just the nozzels? If thats know its easier to quote.

Back to the keeping the programing down. You need to be religous of that. If you crank the progrming up and don't have the fuel to keep up with the injectors you might crack a tip and the worst case it gose through an engine.

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With a stick you can get away with the single 66 and towing heavy with that kinda fuel.
You can hold a gear longer to keep the rpm's up so you don't fall under the turbo.
Not so easly done with an auto trans.

Id look at twins with if you have an auto for that horsepower it would work way better IMO. It will be way better than the a large single charger unless you got a cam to help it out.

Absolutely! I wouldn't try running this setup on an auto unless you do a cam and an aggressive torque converter.

My buddy Billy Martone is running the exact same setup as me on his 06 auto and we did an Industrial Injections cam and valve springs to get it to spool better. We also did an external waste gate to help with turbo surge. It took a little more time to get his truck tuned properly but it can be done.

Twins on an auto would be a more efficient build.

Thanks for the all help trying to help me figure all this out. As for the torque converter yes im going with an aggressive triple billet. As for the twins of couse I would love to run twins but Im not going to be doing that much towing and the towing that I will be doing will be light no more that 8000 10000 max. With a Silver Bullet will I be able to spool it with an auto or will I be fighting boost pressures? Main reason I was looking at the Silver Bullet was the amount of power it can produce, and is rather reasonably priced when coming other turbos of the same size. Haven't ruled out twins just the wallet is only so big. Again thanks for all the advice so far, and please if you have any ideas chime on in!

I wouldn't go with a 66mm than. I'd go with a 64mm tops.
What rear end gears do you have, 4.10's or 3.73's?
This will make a difference of how easy the turbo will come to life.
The problem with an auto is not getting the turbo to go but when the truck grabs overdrive and torque converter is locked you uaualy will fall under the turbos map range and bark the turbo.

The problem with a large single on a auto truck is that its hard to keep the boost up on shifts like us handshaker guys. And they are really surgey unless you wastegate it externally. Thats why we have to use cams agressive converters and valve springs etc

Thanks for the advice fellas. Rear end has the 3:73 gears and way later down the road I may put on a small lift with 35's but for right now the wallet is only open for performance mods. Now if I went with the 64mm silver or similar turbo will that get me to my performance goals? Twins would be great but the wallet is only so big. Also if I went with the 64mm which sounds like the better turbo should I go with 120HPish sticks or 150HPish sticks? Also I am planning on only buying injector nozzles and not the whole injector. Thanks again for all the help so far fellas! Oh and can anyone answer whats the difference between drive pressure and boost presure? I know what boost pressure is but whats drive pressure and where does that play into picking a turbo?:humm:

Drive pressure is the difference between boost and pressure at the exhaust manifold. Its basically the measure of resistance. Ideally you want a 1:1 drive pressure ratio so if you build 40 psi boost you want 40 psi at the exhaust manifold

Thanks Scott that makes sense. Still kinda torn on injector size, turbo size and what one to do first? Been doin quite a bit of research and so far I've found the most agree on too much fuel is better than too much air. However, that comes with the price of high EGTs and high boost numbers. Now is this a true statement or one of those it is but...kinda statements.

OK - diesels run hot on fuel, not air - so you're better off with excess air unless your primary goal is power production. :up2:

Drive pressure - or Turbine Inlet Pressure - is the average PSI found between the cylinders' exhaust valves & turbo's exhaust volute, and as such is a indirect indication of the amount of work (drive HP) available to be exerted on the turbine.
More is better, unless you already have enough - that's why inducer/exducer size, exhaust housing A/R & wastegate selection/tuning is so important... excessive TIP costs power, especially at RPM.

Depending on which injectors you get (significant fuel economy difference between extrude-honed & EDM'd tips at the same HP increase), good fueling software - i.e. Smarty - will allow good mileage & durability out of the engine when you're not leaning on it.

Injector longevity is almost always compromised by 2 issues:
1. excessive rail pressure from stacking fueling boxes & software, running a rail cap, lifting suddenly after a hard run, etc. - great ways to blow tips of the bottom or solenoids off the top.
2. WIF corroding their internal parts, or WIF-generated fuel system detritus filtering out in the bodies' internal clearances.

The HE351 already on your truck would make a good secondary in a twinset - you can pick up an non-WG S400 frame primary on the cheap and either massage the Holset's internal gate to manage the extra drive pressure or use an external gate... with some interstage cooling (actually, your AK temps might do it already!) your goal of 7XX RWHP is readily attainable.

Swapping out the OEM passive-EGR bumpstick is very helpful - it's the gift that just keeps on giving.

Choose your stall speed after your turbo(s) are finished - tight converters & slow spool will keep the truck parked more often.

Make sure your lift pump's water filter flow rating can keep up with the pump GPH - otherwise you'll likely be dealing with a water-in-fuel injector issue at some point.

Also, besides developing much more clamp load, 625+ studs will hold their value far more than anything else - either to you, season after season, or to someone else if your build should change direction.

We have a few trucks running 90hp nozzles and a Silver 62 Turbo. Great Power and Fuel Economy.

what kind of egts are they seeing? I currently have this turbo and am running 37's. I have 4.10 rear gears and a 6 speed. Thanks :c: