solid axle swap
 

alright yawl
ive beedn thinking about doing a solid axle swap on my 04 2500hd. ive been looking at different kits on the new. i was wondering if anyone has done it to there trucks and what they think about it. im just trying to get different people opitions about it. can anyone give me some help on this????

why are you looking at doing the swap? the ride is going to be poopie afterwards

i have had 2 sets of wheel bearings go bad and there gone again. i can get a year out of a set and thats it, ive had to replace tire rod ends on it multi tomes due to the front wheels pulling in when in 4wd, and i have been thinking about hooking it to a sled in the future, i just think that it would be alot stronger than ifs.my buddy has it on his 00 dmax and his dont ride bad.

i slep pull alot, and drag race alot also, i never have any problems with it failing on me after i addressed the small trouble areas. and there are tons of other duramax guys with IFS still being top competitors in sled pulling an drag racing, theres really nothing wrong with it

if your front end is cranked up and your cv angles are extreme it will give you problems in any 4wd situation on the road, it does pull you to the side when you launch in 4wd with the tortion bars cranked up its just how it is.

thats why you see anybody whos going to drag or sled pull u see them drop thier tbars and lower the front end all the way down, it gives you multiple advantages in both competitons

that and upgraded parts.... will help, be a whole bunch cheaper than trying to swap a new axle under it

but if you were gonna do it i would use the Dodge AAM, should be similar, but my Dodge rode like a TANK compared to my dmax:tu:

From what I have read, it takes a 6"+ lift to do the SAS. Thought about it, but for $3k for the kit plus axle and tires / wheels when I was looking, it was not in he budget.

x2 I researched this almost exactly 12 months ago and that was my conclusion. The smallest life you can do for a SAS is 6-8" on a GM right now (supposedly ORU is developing a low-lift SAS kit for our 01+ trucks), in addition to the larger tires you'd run with such a setup. (Probably 35"-37" tires)

Solid Axle Conversion, Convert your Chevy IFS to a Straight axle
cheapest leafsprung kit is $1295

Pure Performance, Inc.
$3000 Dodge AAM axle coil-over kit

I say go for it, despite what everyone else has said so far. IFS sucks!! Sure, tie rod sleeves help but if you want to have dependability off-road, you need a solid axle. Just ask No Problem https://www.dieselbombers.com/off-ro...e-weekend.html
Everyone who has done a SAS to their GM truck will tell you the same thing; basically they got sick of spending $2000 at a time to replace failed IFS parts at regular intervals because it can't take the off-road abuse.

But if you're not gung-ho about going off-road and just want to drive hard on the street, tie-rod sleeves and the other aftermarket pieces should be all that's necessary for that kinda stuff.

You will easily spend over 10 grand on a straight axle swap. And the wheel bearings go bad on those axles too! So you really solve nothing!

If you strengthen the ifs and do not crank the t-bars you should not have trouble. The 3/4 ton ifs is really strong. I have wheeled mine pretty hard for years and have not had any major problems.

and you run over cars too :rocking:

cognito actually sells HD tie-rods that fit under stock height trucks, as well as all the other HD parts to make your IFS as strong as you need to be, and you wont sacrifice your ride

I had to replace tie-rods, wheel barrings, front axel u-joints and a couple other things on my dodge and it ended up costing me something like $1400 for parts at cost! my cousin did the work so that was free, but ouch that hurts, and it needs to be done ever 100,000 miles or so...:td:

Nice to see the level of technical help keeps improving...

ORU kit is solid. I built mine, but unless you wanna go high theres no freaking way you should do the SAS. i regret mine.

well for the cost of the swap you could have the strongest IFS out there, and still have money left in your pocket...:c:

WOW.. ok i have learned quite a bit from what yawl have told me. i thank ya for the information. i guess its now just up to me and what i wana do and spend.

My best advice would be to buy a book on suspensions and gain a thorough understanding of how how they work and the forces involved. As far as design is concerned there really is no practical difference in the performance of a solid axle vs an independent one on a 3/4 ton truck. The failings are in each manufacturers application and their balancing act of assembly time/cost yadda yadda .....

everyone who says you get crappy quality out of a straight axled truck must not ever been in a nice one. they way i build mine ride like a cadillac. and dont buy the ORU kit if your doing it, your paying for the brand. check out Off-Road Direct - Lift Kit and Custom Suspension System Specialists they build kits that only require 3" of lift when installed. call them and tell them you want to use powerstroke super duty springs. theyre 3" wide and handle the weight of the diesels. plus they are almost a foot longer than the springs everyone else uses so ride quality is all there. my truck right now is sooo smooth and i can tuck each and every tire into the fender well, not bad for a 1 ton spring and axle truck.

as for the ifs not holding up, i totally know what your talking about. i will never own another ifs truck in my unless its one hundred percent stock.

the kit for these trucks from offroad direct is only like $750 including high tower shock mounts, spring plates, all the hardware and everything. do that, spend a grand on a nice dana 60, get some springs, shocks, steering, and brake lines and your rollin. you can do the complete kit for about 3 grand. you can make it all yourself its alot cheaper

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the difference in that though is that with the IFS, you have a bunch more things that can go bad.

IFS: control arm bushings, tie rod ends, ball joints, idler arms, etc etc etc

straight axle: leaf spring bushings are really the only part to go out and that isnt often at all.

as for wheel bearings and what not youll have them in your axles either way, but ive gotten 150,000 miles out of dana 60 bearings.

the way it comes down in maintenance if a straight axled front end will require like 1/4 of the attention ifs does, and when it does, its not even close to the same price its way cheaper.

I don't know if you are aware of this fact but solid axles have ball joints (or Kingpins) and tie rod ends too.

I will agree that an IFS is more complex than a leaf sprung SA but is it more complex than a 4 Link?

And maintenance is a wash. Especially if you have a more complicated SA or a better built IFS. Its all in the application.

You can spend less than $3000 and have the best IFS out there period, and it WILL ride better than SFA and still be as strong if not stronger! this whole "IFS is junk" stuff is old, use it the way it was intended to be used and it will do exactly what it is supposed to, when you abuse it, it will break, just like everything else!!

i had a dodge with SFA, rode like a TANK, and i spent a whole bunch of $$$ replacing parts on a truck that lived on the highway(80%highway-20%offroad) with the same KM's as my current Chev and i havnt spent a penny on front end parts yet, they are like new...:tu:

If you wana spend $3000 on an outdated and rough riding technology then go right ahead, i'll spend a few hundred on my soft ride and still be able to do everything i want to do with my truck:c:

Spend 80% off road and 20% on highway and then see which one you like better...

I dont plan on it, because if i had a dodge with that same SFA i would be replacing wheel bearings and tie rod ends and ball joints every 20,000kms.... i dont have $1500 to be doing that ever single time

those wheel bearings are $500-cost each from dodge canada

thanks again for the help. every time i check this im learing more and more yawl have been alot of help. :rocking: now like i said earlier i just gota figure out what i wana do. but why were on this subject. what gear would you run. in thinking about takeing the 3.73 out and put in a 4.10 gear.

the 4.10 wont make a big difference unless your towing alot, your mileage will go down and your rpms will go up while cruising at hwy speeds, the dmax makes plenty of power to displace the need for 4.10's unless you really feel the need to change them... 4.56 would be much more noticable, but only if your running big wheels or towing heavy:tu:

just because your dodge rode like a tan doesnt mean all sfa trucks will. come ride in my chevy youd think your in a cadillac. and as for having the best ifs for the same price, you have to remember they serve completely different purposes, they do what theyre designed to do, and yes they have better ride but the second you lift them you love that and then you start the problem after problem deal. and remember here, he is talking about wanting to wheel his truck, IFS just plain and simple doesnt do that. and the
keyword to your last statement is this:
i'll spend a few hundred on my soft ride and still be able to do everything i want to do with my truck

exactly, what you want to do with your truck, you say you spend 80% on the freeway.


X2:tu:

i dont know where your getting your wheel bearings at, but my wheel bearings cost 40 bucks a piece at the local napa auto parts and i can get 100-150 thousand miles on them.

but the biggest thing about him striaght axling his truck is he would not the use the dodge straight axle that you keep talking about. the CAD system is a horrible design, guess is he would a ford or chevy axle, which is a completely different beast than the CAD axles used in the dodges

the dmax does have the power to not regear, but I would consider it. I know my padre's with just 35s could benifit towing so you don't have to dog it to keep it rollin 80 loaded down.

i would be usein a ford axle most likely. and the reason i ask about the gear swap is that ive heard that it helps out when you have 35s or 37s on your truck which is what i am wanting to run. because ive heard that it brings it back down to what a 373 would do with stock tires.

i have 4.10's on my cummins which probably makes around the same power of your duramax(givin it isnt all beefed up). and i also have 35's. i wouldve stayed with my 3.73's all day long if it was just a driver, the only reason i went to 4.10's is because i have to tow horse and cow trailers alot. and it does help when towing

I have seen plenty IFS trucks lifted and used for wheeling, I dont want to jack my truck up, its a PITA to get in when your only 5'7", and it serves no purpose for me, for you it may, and SFA may very well be the way to go for that, but if your only going to be wheeling occasionally like I do, and you dont need a lift to fit large tires underneath then it really isnt worth it:tu: To each their own, who am i to say what you should do with your truck right?:c:

Wait, How come no one ever brings up TTB swaps? :moon:

exactly:tu: its all for him to decide just tryin to point out the ups of each side. typical rule of thumb for IFS trucks is 4"< lifts are just fine, but a 6"> lift is when you start hitting big problems with cv joints and all your other bushings and ends. i had a 6" on my 91 before i straight axled it, and i was replacing idler arms, pitman arms, tie rod ends, ball joints, etc every 6 months it seemed like

well ive have learned the ups to both ifs and sas thanks again for yawls help. ill post pics and what not when i decide what i wanna do. thanks again and if i have any more questions ill be sure to post them. cause yawl helped out alot.

TTB?:scare2:

ford won the gold metal for worst suspension setup ever with TTB. IMO that is

As with all things it depends on who you ask. For sure the TTB setup is a favorite of tire shops everywhere. As well as quite a few off road racers.

I dont know what kind of offroading ya'll do but 37-40" tall tires n ifs dont work out.I wheel my truck.not drillin roads or fire roads but wheeled.it wont hold up.put lockers in it n it gets worse.you can do a SAS and it will ride good for a SA truck.i mean come on guys its a truck.IFS will hold up sled pullin or drag raceing.once you put big tires and start flexin stuff thats when it starts braken.if your really wheelin or puttin it to it a SAS is the ticket.BUT COME ON half of us arent.therefor a SAS that may just may ride a little ruffer than a IFS truck isnt worth it.IFS is good for what it was ment for.the average person.

im with mudbilly i would like to get rid of my ifs just because i like to play with my trucks and ifs is not strong enough for bigger tires and mud like he said. they make a badass 4 link kit which would be a sweet ride and you would have your sa. it is a complete kit with the axle but the down side to it is its like 18,000 bucks. i am sure most of that $$$$ is the axle but im wondering what it would be worth without the axle included, and go get a older year axle for like 1000 bucks?

offroad direct ( www.offroaddirect.com )makes a 4 link kit for about $3600.you have to get your own axle but.they're stuff is very well built.once i get my diesel :jump:I'm doin a SAS.I'll be useing their super duty kit with stock springs from a diesl.the kit should get me about 3-4" of lift.

triple x traction out of seaside ca sells the best strongest kit u will ever find for straight axling chevys ur cv axles wont hold up for long in my opinion there garbage straight axle all the way! and if u did it urself with just leaf springs u could easily do it for no more than 3,000$ no more camber issues also. the xxxtraction kit is a four link using a superduty ford axle awesome bolt on four link kit! xxxtraction.com check it out

ifs is alot better then solid axle.

It all depends on the application.

Highway...IFS is preferable, however it doesn't mean that a properly engineered SAS that is designed for highway driving (stiffer coil/leaf springs and properly tuned shocks) wont perform well also.

Rock crawling, or other scenarios where MAX articulation and larger tires (37+) are preferred...SAS all the way. A soft coil sprung SAS will out articulate an IFS equipped vehicle, period. Plus an SAS accommodates the lift heights required to run larger tires much more effectively just by design. It also puts WAY too much stress on the suspension components, and yes, a 3/4 ton IFS is indeed strong, but not in the same league as a 1 ton SA. Of course, put that soft sprung SAS'd truck on the highway going 65+, and you'll start to sing a different tune!!:scare2:

Mild trail riding, which is what most are referring to when they say "off roading"...its all personal preference. Both will perform well in this area.

Desert racing...IFS. Handles the high speed bumps well, weighs less, ect. The Ford guys love the TTB for this as well.


Ive SASd a TTB Ford before, and am contemplating the same for when I start upgrading my future Dmax....here are my thoughts in a nutshell:

IFS is cheaper, no matter how you slice it. Yes, you can do the ORD kt, but you still need a D60 or D44, which will need at least a partial rebuild, plus steering, plus springs, brake lines, drive shaft, shocks, most likely regear...plus now you have a standard lug pattern up front, and a metric lug pattern in the rear, so youll need two sets of wheels, or some wheel adapters for the rear...it starts to add up. :argh:
HOWEVER, a SA is simple in design, and Cheap and easy to maintain...keep in mind, were talking a '79 D60, so the whole $500 to replace the Hub centric "unit bearing" issue doesn't apply.

Just my .02...good luck with your decision :tu: